Space Monsters!!!

Trachmyr · #1 July 7th, 2001, 11:49 PM

Ok folks, I'm writing a mod for space monters... only need to finish the AI_const_vehicles, AI_DesignCreation, find componet/facility pics and get permission to use the Cephalopeia ship set.

But I have a question for you... Would you want a mod that is "error-trapped" OR one that is compatible with TDM???

Here's my quandry, right now it's compatible with TDM... it adds stuff, but dosen't change anything already there. But there *can* be some problems... if the monsters get ahold of tech their not suppose to (particularly ship construction) they might produce ships that aren't "right"... also their facilities are WAY overpowered if a human captures one (they are balanced for them though), this shouldn't be too easy as they are to produce lots of troops and most of their systems will have a "Change bad Intelligence -100%" ability... but it can happen.

The way to fix this is by going the P&N route and creating a "normal tech - racial trait" thus disallowing the space monsters the normal technology (and I wouldn't need to make such uber facilities to ensure that the space monsters use 'em and only them)... this is a bit of extra work on my part, and means that all empires will need to be "adapted", it dosen't take too long but it reduces compatiability.

What do you guys think?

Also, if you have/know of good "organic-looking" componets facility pics let me know... I need 'em and I'm not an artist!

[This message has been edited by Trachmyr (edited 08 July 2001).]

Trachmyr · #2 July 8th, 2001, 10:41 PM

Anyone? opinions? I'm almost done (just need a few componet pics, and get permission to use the ship set), and I need to know what the seiv comunity would prefer... a completely "non-abusable" mod or a stdandard seiv/tdm compatible mod.

Please let me know...

PsychoTechFreak · #3 July 8th, 2001, 11:29 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Trachmyr:
... a completely "non-abusable" mod or a stdandard seiv/tdm compatible mod.

Please let me know...

I would prefer the "non-abusable" Version. Otherwise -I guess- even if the human players are self-restrictive the monster techs could be found in ruins by the other AIs. OTOH, if your mod is not compatible with TDM then it could cause a lot of work -from your side

- every time when a new patch comes out ?

Trachmyr · #4 July 9th, 2001, 04:26 AM

thanks for the feed-back...

It won't be that abusable... all of the monster tech is a racial trait (although a 0 point one), but to make sure the "monsters" only use stuff from this tech I have to make their facilites (Larval Pool, Metamorphisis Nodes, Central Nervous Nexus and Organic Harvesters) "uber-facilites"... i.e., they produce alot more than their "non-monster" counterparts... but they have inherent disadvantages due to their culture setting that off-sets it. But if a human can capture one of their worlds, it could be abused.... I have them building alot of troops/fighters for defense and they get a 100% ground combat bonus and the first facility they build gives the "reduces bad intel" at 100% (I don't know if this actually works yet). They won't research/build normal stuff (even the ship sizes they use are non-standard (i.e., a small queen is 440KT a Large Soldier is 560KT) and the ai_design_creation file specifies these EXACT non-standard sizes) and they won't except trades/gifts (or any form of diplomacy) giving them the tech...

What I'm worried about is players doing their best to CAPTURE these worlds instead of glassing them... If I require all other empires to take a racial trait (0-point) of "Not a monster" (ala P&N), I can completely remove the monsters acess to normal stuff, thus I don't have to make their facilities "uber-facs"... but all empire files will have to be altered, both currently in se4/tdm and all future ones (not to mention requiring a larger .zip)

So now that I've explained it a bit further, what do you think... is the possibility of abuse remote enough that I can leave it like it is... or should I go ahead and create a "Normal" racialtrait and alter techarea.txt and all the .emp files?

Phoenix-D · #5 July 9th, 2001, 04:55 AM

Hate to tell ya, but I think if you add ANY new racial traits- even if the empire doesn't use em- the empires need to be redone.

As for human players capturing- they won't be able to build- you can't analyze racial techs, remember- so it wouldn't be THAT bad. Or.. hrm. I wonder if you could make the ships zero cost, then specifiy the planets to make one spaceyard/queen ship and abandon?

Phoenix-D

Trachmyr · #6 July 9th, 2001, 05:26 AM

Yep... just found that out, I got to make all new .emp files! great, and I thought I was almost done

Oh, well... I guess I might as well do it the "safer way" now.

BTW, I know that the tech couldn't be analyzied... I was just afraid of humans getting ahold of a built-up hive... And I wish I could get them to abandon a colony, but there's no way to do it that I know of...

TaeraRepublic · #7 July 9th, 2001, 10:44 AM

Then try and create a self-destruct building for a planet -> IF the planet gets captured, then all the facilities will self destruct

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Q · #8 July 9th, 2001, 05:56 PM

quote:
Originally posted by TaeraRepublic:
Then try and create a self-destruct building for a planet -> IF the planet gets captured, then all the facilities will self destruct

This would be a new ability and it is not possible for us to create new ones. Only MM can do this.

Suicide Junkie · #9 July 9th, 2001, 06:14 PM

quote:
This would be a new ability and it is not possible for us to create new ones. Only MM can do this.

Self-destruct is not a new ability; putting it on a planet just hasn't been tried before.

quote:
If I require all other empires to take a racial trait (0-point) of "Not a monster" (ala P&N), I can completely remove the monsters acess to normal stuff, thus I don't have to make their facilities "uber-facs"... but all empire files will have to be altered, both currently in se4/tdm and all future ones (not to mention requiring a larger .zip)

I would be happy to add a "monster mod" mode to my AI Patcher program, and you could use it to patch your AIs quickly. The players could download it too, and patch the new AIs as they come out.

The addition would be only 6 lines of code or so, plus helpfile, if I add it on to what I've got already.
What I need to know is:
1) The exact spelling (including upper/lower case) of the racial trait.
2) Any help comments you want to add.
Everything else is already done.

Check my sig for a link to the AIPatcher.

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[This message has been edited by suicide_junkie (edited 09 July 2001).]

Markavian · #10 July 9th, 2001, 06:33 PM

I'm liking the sound of this monster patch.
If you want TDM compatability yo do need to change the EMP files and General_AI for all of them. However, you don't need to include all the bitmaps.

Alot of effort on your part, but you'll save the end user alot of effort, and thats apreciated > makes you mod more sucessful

.

Self destruct: Has anyone thoguht about destroying the whole planet?! I'm sure theres an option for that :-\

Or maybe you could program the AI to do that after capture.
> Monster AI aren't allowed to build planetary shield generators either in that case.

If you're not allowed to use the cehalopeia fleet just say 'You need to install this shipset first' go and download from here: http://universalshipyards.tripod.com
or from his brother's home site: http://se4kdy.cyberwars.com'

Then your will be titchy, about 200kb max, just for those AI updates and data files!