New SE4 Race: Minbari

[DaftWager]

Ok, sounds good. I'll get to work right away!

[thorfrog]

Any update on these new Minbari pictures? I have added some pictures of my own. I'll forward them to you if you want them.

[Master Belisarius]

Hi Warlord!
I was testing the Minbari AI, and have some observations. Of course that you can agree or not, but here are:

First, the positive ones.
1) They expand very fast.
2) They can amass really big fleets, because their ship designs are cheap to maintain (the DUC cannons are really cheap!).
3)If they can survive the early game, they can research very fast (I think that you have designed this race for big maps and 5 or 10 starting planets).


The negative (of course that in my view).

1) They research very early in the game, Applied Research II and Applied Research III. It mean that in games with small maps and a few starting planets, they will take a loooong time researching these techs... and then, during this time, they are an easy prey for aggressive races (for example, the Rage, the Pyrochette, the Klingon, Romulan and several other TDM races).

2)I think that the DUC cannons are a weak weapon against ships with PPB, Organic Weapons, Temporal Weapons, etc. I saw a fleet of 25 Minbari ships (Destroyers, Light Cruisers and Cruisers), defeated by 4 Romulan Light Cruisers!

Later in the game, I saw Minbari ships with Ripper Beams and Incinirator Beams. These weapons are ok, but have a really short range. It mean that fighting against races with Engine Damaging weapons (like the Pyrochette or the Aquilaeian), they can't do anything.

3) They start to research the Religious tech, after a lot of turns. It mean that they can't take advantage from the cool Shirines, during a long time.

[Sinapus]

Do they also have the disadvantage of surrendering on the eve of victory when at war against the Earth Alliance?

[thorfrog]

It's funny right now I am using Earth Alliance and the Minbari approached me for trade,research, and partnership alliances. They're my buddies. They are at war with the borg.

[Warlord Adamus]

"Any update on these new Minbari pictures? I have added some pictures of my own. I'll forward them to you if you want them. "

Sure, feel free to send. Iv'e just received some very nice pics from Mr. Schizo, and I should be finished with the latest Version by the end of this week.

"First, the positive ones.
1) They expand very fast.
2) They can amass really big fleets, because their ship designs are cheap to maintain (the DUC cannons are really cheap!).
3)If they can survive the early game, they can research very fast (I think that you have designed this race for big maps and 5 or 10 starting planets).
"

All good observations.

"1) They research very early in the game, Applied Research II and Applied Research III. It mean that in games with small maps and a few starting planets, they will take a loooong time researching these techs... and then, during this time, they are an easy prey for aggressive races (for example, the Rage, the Pyrochette, the Klingon, Romulan and several other TDM races)."

Interesting.. Could you describe the setup that causes them to expand slowly ? Just about all of my test games, (almost 20) were low bonus, 1 planet starts. My findings were that they out-expanded just about everyone with the exception being the EA, and then only because the Minbari produce many more warships - earlier.

"2)I think that the DUC cannons are a weak weapon against ships with PPB, Organic Weapons, Temporal Weapons, etc. I saw a fleet of 25 Minbari ships (Destroyers, Light Cruisers and Cruisers), defeated by 4 Romulan Light Cruisers! "

They are also designed to use High-energy weapons when they have the tech. I chose DUC because they were cheap weapons that could hold their own (somewhat) until the Minbari get High Energy. When they develop a mix of both they are much more effective, though admittedly a bit under-gunned. I wanted them to be fast, and multi-role so they can carry solar sails, minesweepers, sensors..kind of a trade-off.

"Later in the game, I saw Minbari ships with Ripper Beams and Incinirator Beams. These weapons are ok, but have a really short range. It mean that fighting against races with Engine Damaging weapons (like the Pyrochette or the Aquilaeian), they can't do anything."

Both the DUC and WMG have a short range. In theory, since I made research and propulsion such a high priority, the Minbari speed advantage should cancel out their lack of range. Are you not finding that this is the case ?

"3) They start to research the Religious tech, after a lot of turns. It mean that they can't take advantage from the cool Shirines, during a long time."

I'll have to look into this. I had them earlier up the line and found out that they really slowed down research. I have to find that perfect medium.

Great to hear from you MB, thanks for the help !

[Master Belisarius]

Hi Warlord!!

"Interesting.. Could you describe the setup that causes them to expand slowly ?"

They doesn't expand slowly, they expand very very fast.
The problem (in my view), is that in games where they find aggressive races early (in games with small galaxy and 3 or 5 starting planets), while the Minbari are researching Applied Research II and III (and could take a lot of turns), the others are researching better techs for their warships... then, the Minbari could have problems (in fact, in my games they had) to survive the early game.

"They are also designed to use High-energy weapons when they have the tech. I chose DUC because they were cheap weapons that could hold their own (somewhat) until the Minbari get High Energy. When they develop a mix of both they are much more effective, though admittedly a bit under-gunned. I wanted them to be fast, and multi-role so they can carry solar sails, minesweepers, sensors..kind of a trade-off."

I can see your intentions, but the High Energy weapons take long time to research...
Honestly, still I like more the PPB weapons.
The good thing, is that the Duc cannons used in the Minbari fighters, are very good!


"Both the DUC and WMG have a short range. In theory, since I made research and propulsion such a high priority, the Minbari speed advantage should cancel out their lack of range. Are you not finding that this is the case ?"

True, but against ships with Ionic Disperser weapons (I love this weapon!), they have problems.
An example are the Aquilaeian Empire and the Pyrochette Empire (of course that both are my AI's! Remember you the old days? ).

"I'll have to look into this. I had them earlier up the line and found out that they really slowed down research. I have to find that perfect medium."
Ok.

"Great to hear from you MB, thanks for the help !"
Hehehe, thanks Warlord! I think that you could recognize my spell (or lack of), very fast!
Finally, want to say that I wrote my observations, not only because wanted to help you... also was... because I have enjoyed a lot the Minbari!