Frost immune Devils?

[Graeme Dice]

Boron said:
If they also get Weapons of Sharpness they are very good .

True, but even then they can't hit ethereal or mistformed troops very well.

Against 350 Devils as Chazar describes a few false horrors won't be enough to hold them off.

Who said anything about a few false horrors? Send in 20 seraphs, and you'll have 40 a turn.

100 Mech men and a few mages will probably win , 100 Storm demons maybe also.

Both of those are huge gem investments. 20 Seraphs is 2000 gold and lost research at what sounds like the stage of the game where research is just about over.

How would you protect a SC to say he will survive vs. 50 devils surrounding him and buffed by weapons of sharpness?

For an air queen.
Blood Thorn, Lucky Coin, Starshine Skullcap, Jade Armour, Antimagic Amulet, Ring of Regen. Cast mistform, mirror image, attack rear or closest.

Even 30 protection get halfed because of the ap so it would be 15 prot + 2d6 vs. 21 devil trident damage + 2d6 damage roll .

Each hit until a very large one occurs however, would only do 1 damage. He also hasn't said anything about weapons of sharpness or high-level earth magic, so It's probably not a factor.

Without unique items how would you equip your mass produced AQ vs. devils ?

Mass produced Air Queens? I'm trying to limit this to the situation described by the original poster, not imaginary situations. Basically, you need luck, lifedrain, quickness, and regeneration. You also want a storm. If it was ice devils vs. normal devils, then the equipment loadout is quite different.

There it would be: Blood Thorn, Lucky Coin, Robe of Shadows, Flying Boots, Antimagic Amulet, Ring of Regen.

Of course, this assumes that no battlefield magic is being used, in which case, you'll have to use different tactics.

[Huzurdaddi]

Against devils the standard tactic is a prot 26+ SC for tanking and a wraithful skies capable caster far behind. Further a Prot 26+ tank with some serious weapons ( ember? ) can kill almost any number of devils even without the wrathful.

*If* the devils have weapons of sharpness prot will not work as well. Actually devils with weapons of sharpness are particularly hard to take on but they are rarely seen. However I just tested an SC with 30 prot and a life drain weapon against 100 devils and the SC still wins ( weird I would not have expected that ).

With Caelum your options open up from the standard tactics. But all anti-devil tactics ( except for massive prot SC's ) start with the Staff of Storms and wrathful skies. The false horror spam is a standard with Caelum.

[Taqwus]

Bait them into a province and then spam Murdering Winter. Unless they're moving magically, you'll hit them before they move.

[Endoperez]

Depending on who/what is leading them, you might try to kill those commanders and then force the whole army to retreat to nothingness in you territory. However, I don't think simple Seeking Arrows will be enough...

[Graeme Dice]

Endoperez said:
Depending on who/what is leading them, you might try to kill those commanders and then force the whole army to retreat to nothingness in you territory.

Iron dragons are also very good at killing devils, if you have the earth magic for it.

[Huzurdaddi]

Graeme Dice said:

Iron dragons are also very good at killing devils, if you have the earth magic for it.

What is actually good at killing devils ( and I can not for the life of me figure out why ) is ghost riders.

I have no idea why they work but 8 castings will kill about 120 devils. Quite a bargin.

Again: I have no idea why. From the stats you would think that the longdead would not even be able to hit.

[Turin]

it´s the charge bonus of the lance, those riders are really insane.

[Chazar]

Wow, lots of useful stuff here! More on the background: We're on Karan, the game is quasi-over with me owning pretty much, but I refused to end the game without ever battling Abysia, since I never played a high-magic endgame before, so I insisted to get a beating! (There is Carrion Woods still there as well having quite some armies and most Artifacts as I can tell, but Cainehill seems to forget about this game despite occasional reminders... well, if the devils continue to remain unbeaten and Carrion Woods reawakes, I fear that I could still loose the game though... ) So I want to learn endgame-fighting. Inviting the devils for battle is not a concern, neither is wishing or clamming on my side, since that yields no insights for me...

At least for me, Research was finished a couple of turns ago. We are around 80+. There are healthy Tartarians on both sides (though I cannot heal them - maybe I should try some global spells other than a mere GaleGate...). EarthMagic is not a problem for both sides, too. My first mistake, I guess, was to split up my forces: ~40 StormDemons with AirQueens, ~40 Frost Fiends with 2 IceDevils, ~40 Vine Ogres with Tarrasque. Each pack backed up by 4-8 path-booster equipped seraphs, staff of storms, some seraphs and seraphines, few archers for chaff, etc. The IceDevils brought along an IronDragon, the Tarrasque an awakened Tartarian Sprit (Ember,Blood Thorn, Horrorhelm,Ded Dragon Scale,Rings of Warrior and Regen) and an afflicted spirit.

The enemy fields Devils, Heliophagus, ArchDevils, AbysianMages and a few storm demons. Boosters: Rush of Strength, Heat from Hell, Legions of Steel.

Some numbers:
IceFiends: 8 commanders, 55troops versus 6/340: 3 devils killed.
Storm: 6/50 vs. 10/475: 16 devils killed.
Tarrasque: 16/145 vs. 9/400: 105 devils killed.

So far, so nice. I was not impressed with the IronDragon, but it charged alone into the enemy ranks and died after dealing damage twice. I think it might not be well suited against size3 Devils because of its trampling attack despite having low AP.

Only the pack with the tarrasque did some damage, but that was probably due to three castings of NiefelFlames: A shot left most of the devils inside around 20hp (so 15hp damage), some few as low as 6hp, but never killing. However, I think it might be more cost effective to cast falling frost instead (considering fatigue and gems):

NiefelFlames: Range 35+, Area 25+, Fatigue 2/200, Dmg: 10(a.n.)
FallingFrost: Range 40+, Area 5+, Fatigue 20-, Dmg: 17+

Another thing I should have worried about is the heat: The last battlefield was around heat1-2, while the others where at cold1. I guess NiefelFlames are probably effected by the heat scale, so I shall retry (there are enough devils left ) with casting WolvenWinter before! And I will give Grip of Winter a try.

MurderingWinter was a disappointment though: I tried that a few turns ago, but the report showed only 10 hurt units, none killed for an army of more than 400! I did cast WolvenWinter twice that round to ensure that one of the castings was before, and indeed in the reports, one casting was beofre the MurderingWinter.

Wrathful Skies is nice, but I am deperately wondering what that Cold-Sensitivity of the Devils is good for...

----------
I meant DragonHelmets: 0 Enc, but 50% Fire Protection to complement the 50% from the burning pearl, sorry! But I guess I should not worry about that anymore: I will try Army of Gold instead, so 50% from the buring pearl might be enough if the boni stack. But Army of Gold does not protect from fires from the sky, so my seraphs should still wear more protective gear...

[Boron]

Graeme Dice said:

True, but even then they can't hit ethereal or mistformed troops very well.

Who said anything about a few false horrors? Send in 20 seraphs, and you'll have 40 a turn.

Both of those are huge gem investments. 20 Seraphs is 2000 gold and lost research at what sounds like the stage of the game where research is just about over.

With 20 Seraphs there is the problem of rain of stones and earthquake though . The tartarian cyclops has always 2A 3E as magic . He could easily do rain of stones , weapons of sharpness with earthboots , earthquake , petrify , legions of steel , strength of giants .

The game seems to be in the stage where Tartarians are commonly available . 700 devils alone cost 4900 blood when summoned or 1500-2000 when generated by 25 soul contracts forged with or without hammers .

My guess would be that the game is at turn 50-70 .

I fully agree with etheral + mistform + luck . There something like devil thugs with moon blades would probably be needed

[quote]
Graeme Dice said:

Boron said:

Mass produced Air Queens? I'm trying to limit this to the situation described by the original poster, not imaginary situations. Basically, you need luck, lifedrain, quickness, and regeneration. You also want a storm. If it was ice devils vs. normal devils, then the equipment loadout is quite different.

There it would be: Blood Thorn, Lucky Coin, Robe of Shadows, Flying Boots, Antimagic Amulet, Ring of Regen.

Of course, this assumes that no battlefield magic is being used, in which case, you'll have to use different tactics.

Yeah etheralness is one of the most important skills for an anti-troop SC imo . Without stuff like Elephants or other good tramplers can kill your SC luckily also .

I am tensed at which turn Chazars game is if it is >60 then mass produced AQs could be soon a reality