Baby dies while parents play World of Warcraft

[FJ_MD]

What you say, Mephisto, is right but I still think that the baby must have the priority.


I don't want to judge the parents, but some errors in this case were made.

[Mindi]

Mephisto,

Addressing your points:

1. They actually have specialized pillows so they can't roll over now and accidently suffocate as this poor child did. There are other methods that people use to make cribs and sleeping in general safer for a baby. Of course there are no guarantees.

2. Babies should only be left for hours during the night when parents are sleeping. I would think at 4 months however you would still be using a baby monitor and be getting up during the night to check on the child as well. Granted, this does not guarantee a baby will not suffocate, but they are basic safety precautions that most parents use to ensure they know if their baby is in trouble. And the fact remains that in this case they chose to leave a baby alone for 5 hours with no one in earshot to hear if the child was in trouble or to check on the child. In the states if you did that and the authorities found out, your child would be taken from you and put in foster care until you got some parenting courses and proved you were a fit parent along with dealing with criminal charges of neglect.

3. Playing a computer game is irrelivent, the neglect is not. I purposely said that the baby died from neglect and not a computer game as the computer game did not suffocate the baby, nor could it. I see this as a selfish act in which they are now responsible for the death of their child. What they were addicted to that they chose to put priority above their child is irreleveant--they could have been partying, at a bar, shopping, whatever--that doesn't matter. What matters is that the parents were neglectful and negligent in their daughter's death by leaving her, a 4 month old baby, in a house by herself for 5 hours. The implication from the parents that it would have been okay if they left her for only 1-2 hours by herself as usual completely boggles my mind. It shows that their parenting is lacking as is their judgement. Especially considering there was someone living right upstairs that could have watched the infant, but they chose to leave her alone anyway.

Just my $.02

[Leslie]

I find Mephisto's post a bit weird to be honest. No offense.

Yes accidents happen, that's why they are called accidents.

When my son was an infant though, I was unable to NOT contiuously check the lad. And I only slept when it was my turn. My wife and I basically didn't sleep normal for about 3 years.

In that time, yes accidents might have occurred, hence the term.

And yes, I had a baby monitor going.
I often held my son as he slept. He slept many sleep times while I held him safe. I would watch TV and would not be concerned about my son, as I was holding him.

Parents come in all manner of varieties. And I won't cut any slack for those that should have opted for oral sex the time their child was conceived.

Newborns face so many challenges when they are born. And the first 3 years are just one long challenge. Not that your 15 year old son is much safer. Might not die from crib death, but he still has to pass through being a teenager

The facts are, the parents were not present in the room, they were not present in the home and they were not making a hurried dash to a very close store to get something utterly essential.
No, they ABANDONED the child. And all so they could go out and play a %$#@%# online video game.

For starters, they should have their fingers broken, made incapable of ever using a mouse or keyboard.
They should have their pictures displayed so all could see them for the fools they truely are.
Warning, don't make the mistake of leaving your kids in the care of this couple, their own offspring wasn't safe, and neither will yours be.

Excessive you say, nope, I don't think I am being excessive at all.

The baby suffocated.
The baby could have burned in a fire that the parents would have been oblivious to. The baby could have been stolen by a thief.
The manner of harm that might have befallen the child is hard to estimate, because let's face it, the parents would not have been there to do anything about it.

[Mephisto]

No problem. I'm a bit weird.
You are all right that the baby should have the highest priority. There is no debating that and no one did. But let’s not forget that not all people live the way you and I live.

Yes, there might be pillows that prevent the rolling and suffocation. But not everyone has access to them. The medical standards of the US are not met by most of the world.

Yes, there are monitors. “Real” monitors – not baby phones- are expensive and will not be covered by insurances if no hint for a higher risk for SIDS is diagnosed (talking for Germany, of course). Baby phones make you feel save but you aren’t. If a baby suffocates, it doesn’t cry any more. It has no breath for it [Hence the “first” rule for a paramedic: The one who can cry is treated last, he has enough breath. The ones not crying any more are the severe patients.]. I had my share of SIDS as a paramedic and the parents were sleeping right next to the child.

Yes, I wouldn’t let my child be alone for any length of time. However, we all do not know when the baby died. It could have been 2 minutes after the last person left it or 2 minutes before they returned. Before calling for punishment we should convince ourselves if they could have done anything about it. Just because they were not there did not necessarily killed the baby. That’s my main point.

Leslie, I admire your resolution to sleep in shifts and have a constant watch over your child. But I stand to my point that not very many parents can do this, neither physically nor economically.

[Leslie]

My key point though, remains that the parents, through entirely screwed in the head logic, figured they actually could leave a child alone, with them not even being remotely close at hand, so that they could go and stroke an obvious obsession.

These two parents are not in the same category as any other parent that has had to suffer the grief of finding their loved one dead through a cruel act of fate.

Damn it but I hope it makes them grieve. I hope they suffer for the rest of their lives.

They didn't even make the attempt to even try to ensure the safety of their child. They didn't even make the effort.

[Mephisto]

Leslie, on this we agree.

[Mindi]

Mephisto said:
No problem. I'm a bit weird.
You are all right that the baby should have the highest priority. There is no debating that and no one did. But let’s not forget that not all people live the way you and I live.

I don't see this as a subjective thing depending on the way someone lives, I see this as a basic responsibility of having kids.

Yes, there might be pillows that prevent the rolling and suffocation. But not everyone has access to them. The medical standards of the US are not met by most of the world.

This is why I said there were "other methods". There are ways to wedge blankets and regular pillows so that the baby can't move.

Yes, there are monitors. “Real” monitors – not baby phones- are expensive and will not be covered by insurances if no hint for a higher risk for SIDS is diagnosed (talking for Germany, of course). Baby phones make you feel save but you aren’t. If a baby suffocates, it doesn’t cry any more. It has no breath for it [Hence the “first” rule for a paramedic: The one who can cry is treated last, he has enough breath. The ones not crying any more are the severe patients.]. I had my share of SIDS as a paramedic and the parents were sleeping right next to the child.

What you call "baby phones" is what most people call Baby Monitors. You can pick them up in the US starting at about $30. No they are not full proof, but if your baby starts making noises during it's sleep, you should hear it and be alerted to go in and check on the baby. Furthermore, we're not talking about a case of SIDS here, the article says when they got home they found her on her stomach which leads one to believe that they did not place her that way, she rolled over. In which case, see my above response.

Yes, I wouldn’t let my child be alone for any length of time. However, we all do not know when the baby died. It could have been 2 minutes after the last person left it or 2 minutes before they returned. Before calling for punishment we should convince ourselves if they could have done anything about it. Just because they were not there did not necessarily killed the baby. That’s my main point.

When the baby died is irrelevant. The question is, were they negligent (failing to give proper care and attention) in the death of their child and therefore should they be punished? Could they have forseen that leaving a 4 month old alone for 5 hours could result in the baby dying or coming to harm? I think the answer is obviously yes.

I will use this metaphor on how I see this: if I let my friend drive my car and that person gets into an accident, that is a true accident and it is not my fault in any way--I could not have forseen the accident. HOWEVER, if I let my friend drive my car while KNOWING THEY ARE DRUNK OUT OF THEIR MIND and they get into an accident, I am negligent and therefore have committed a crime and should be punished.

No, it is not the same severity as if I intentionally committed a crime, but I knew very well a horrible accident could occur by letting my friend drive my car while intoxicated and I lent them my car anyway.

Leslie, I admire your resolution to sleep in shifts and have a constant watch over your child. But I stand to my point that not very many parents can do this, neither physically nor economically.

I think we shall agree to disagree on this issue as I see much of your arguments to be 'strawmen' arguments in that they don't fit this particular case in which very poor judgement was used. I agree that not everyone can watch their child 24/7. However, we are not talking about someone who went out to their mailbox to get their mail and came back in to find their child suffocated. We're not talking about someone who went to sleep and when they got up to check on their child in the night, they found their child had died from SIDS. Those are horrible tragedies that no parent should have to go through IMO and I feel sorry for anyone who has had to go through that kind of loss.

Instead we are talking about careless and neglectful parents who felt it was okay to leave their child home alone in house for hours at a time. Did they find a babysitter? No. Did they call the neighbor to go down and check on her from time to time even? No. Did they even think twice about leaving this child home alone? Well from the statement they made, I would think the answer to that is No (unless it took more than 2 hours, they only feel guilty it seems about that part). Parents are responsible for their child's well being and safety until they are to the age to take care of themselves. To me it seems they not only failed to do this (by choice, not by mere accident) but they laughed in the face of it by putting their desire to play a game above their child's well being and leaving the child home alone for 5 hours. An act that I believe the majority of people would find indefensible and unforgivable.

Simply put, I hope they throw the book at them.

Mindi signing out.

[Phoenix-D]

"What you call "baby phones" is what most people call Baby Monitors. You can pick them up in the US starting at about $30. No they are not full proof, but if your baby starts making noises during it's sleep, you should hear it and be alerted to go in and check on the baby."

The point being that in this situation..that wouldn't have done a thing. The baby likely died without making a sound.

[Atrocities]

Sad news. But like with everything, soon the internet and games will be advertised as the new evil of our age and politically motivated oppertunistic SOB's will jump on the "ban us from our freedom of choice" band wagon and pass really rediculas laws governing how we as preportedly free people use our computers and the internet.

First off parents have a responsiblity to take care of their children. The fact that these two negelected to do so is cannot be blamed on the World Of Warcraft or any other computer game. They chose to make a bad decison and a child died for it and now they must pay for the decision they made. If this had occured in the USA I would have no doubt that the Parents would be billed as the victims and the World Of Warcraft would be vilified and sued by every leach lawyer ambulance chaser this nation has to offer.

Watch, as they sued the big tobacco, the firearms industry, fast food, now shall they sue video game developers.

Give me a break.