SC's vs Thugs

[Vicious Love]

Boron said:
First i didn't want to sound know-it-all, i hope you didn't get this intention from my post .

Not at all. Erm... sorry I gave the impression that I got that impression, I guess.

I am personally no big fan of SCs. Problem is that you never can't design your SC to survive all possible threats.

Well, yeah. Thugs are always expendable, SCs... not so much. Especially since a true SC often calls for a unique artifact or two. I think that's another loose guideline for drawing the fuzzy line between thug and SC.
I don't really like SCs either, unless I know precisely what sort of opposition I'll be facing. Still, if you've gone to the trouble of securing some of the more powerful unique artifacts, you owe it to yourself to give them the most survivable chassis you can find.

I said Arlabests, not X-bows . An Arlabest does 17 ap damage, a X-bow only 10.

14 in the unmodded game, but that extra 4 AP damage is still pretty significant.
So even with a robe of invulnerability the Arlabest should do some damage.

But what's more important and that makes me normally rather dislike SCs: The enemy will also have mage support or thugs.
If the enemy has a combination of high damage troops and anti-SC mages you can't protect vs. everything.

Not always true. No SC is utterly indestructible, all can be stalled until turn 50, all can be easily paralyzed with Petrify and, yes, all are tremendously susceptible to Drain Life. Those two spells aside, though, there are still SCs that are virtually immune to lower-end mages and unspecialized, general-purpose thugs, save in vast numbers.
With the right chassis and the right combination of unique artifacts, you can field a regenerating, lifedraining, self-reinvigorating, elemental-immune, magic-resistant monstrosity. There will still be counters, but your opponent will have to put some thought into them in order to be cost-effective.

[shovah]

a fun tactic is to get a load of flying sc's in one place as if massing for an attack then when the enemy brings over his anti sc mages shoot right past them

[Valandil]

Banefire? Gifts From Heaven? 72 quickened arch seraphs casting lightening bolt?

If you live through these (except for the seraphs... then you are an sc. Otherwise, you are dead and it doesn't matter.

Seriously, the line between a thug and an sc is so blurred as to be meaningless. The best rule I've found is that if it kills armies then it is good, otherwise, don't use it.

[shovah]

iirc gifts from heaven and banefire are quite inaccurate. and as for the seraphs just make him immune to lightning (and hope they dont spam wolves )

[Cainehill]

Innacurate? They hit a hex. If your caster has air magic, or an eye of aiming, or 1 nature for eagle eyes, I wouldn't want to be much under tartarian, prophetized Niefel, or pretender (in friendly dominion). As far as the seraphs go - best make sure he's immune to cold as well (but doesn't frozen heart damage cold immunes?).

And, shovah : rarely does someone have _so_ many SCs of any nature that they can mass a "load of" flying ones. Other than the Air Queens, most SCs don't fly, and making them fly wastes a slot, often making them "a dead former SC known as Prince" or some such.

[Cainehill]

Valandil said:
Seriously, the line between a thug and an sc is so blurred as to be meaningless. The best rule I've found is that if it kills armies then it is good, otherwise, don't use it.

How about this : The SC is the one where, you weep if you lose it.

[shovah]

lol, i remember the time i thought id lost my uber tooledup golem to ulmish pd, i almost punched my monitor in but then i remembered it was just a commander id sacrificed