Conceptual Balance Mod 5.4

[Oversway]

You think so? I think it should be the nations should be equal to each other, but not necessarily the starting commanders.

[KissBlade]

alright if that's true ... then why the heck does Vanheim have such a vastly superior starting commanders compared to base TC? It's not exactly like TC is the epitome of broken or Vanheim is the suck.

[Oversway]

Maybe the right way to "fix" TC is with starting commanders. I wouldn't know. I just don't think that

The starting commanders should all be somewhat equal in cold cost ...

makes for as fun of a game. For me, the more different nations play, the better.

[NTJedi]

Questions:
Reviewing the CB 5.2 readme text of the changes and I have some questions.

1) Why has AIM been given Precision of 100?? I believe the original 5 was way too low... but an increase to 100 seems way too much. That's giving a mage perfection at casting.... a bonus of 22 feels more accurate. lvl_1 alteration

2) Why is Baleful Star only 1 astral?? Reading the spell description I believed this spell gave a percentage chance for troops to be cursed in the target province... for 1 astral that's way too good of a deal. Perhaps I'm wrong on what the spell does. lvl_5 alteration

3) I don't see why the spell heal had it's distance reduced by half. Was the spell really too powerful before?
lvl_3 enchantment

4) Why were Foul Air and Lure of the Deep dropped so drastically in gem price?? Seems too extremely easy to get these nasty spells up. lvl_6&7 thaumaturgy

5) Why is the Ivy King more equal in stats with a Vine Ogre?? (Sea)Trolls are not more equal in stats with (Sea)Troll Kings. summoned monster

6) One of the Ice Devils originally had fire immunity which is not listed in the readme text file. Why has his fire immunity been removed for that specific Ice Devil??


The other changes all look good or great from the quick review I finished.

--------------
quick comment: Bog Beasts should have higher morale otherwise they usually quickly flee.

[Graeme Dice]

1) Why has AIM been given Precision of 100?? I believe the original 5 was way too low... but an increase to 100 seems way too much.

Aim provides a boost of 5 precision. The 100 precision on the spell represents the accuracy with which the aim spell will hit the target grid square that the mage that casts it wants it to hit. With the old precision on aim, it could miss, which made it pretty useless compared to eagle eyes.

2) Why is Baleful Star only 1 astral?? Reading the spell description I believed this spell gave a percentage chance for troops to be cursed in the target province... for 1 astral that's way too good of a deal.

It will curse about a dozen troops, which is really weak for the original cost.

4) Why were Foul Air and Lure of the Deep dropped so drastically in gem price?? Seems too extremely easy to get these nasty spells up.

They are very situational, and both use gems that would be much better spent on other things given the original cast. Have you ever seen a game won or lost because of either spell?

6) One of the Ice Devils originally had fire immunity which is not listed in the readme text file. Why has his fire immunity been removed for that specific Ice Devil??

Balance purposes. The ice devils were taken down to -50% fire resistance.

[NTJedi]

Graeme Dice...
I don't follow on the AIM spell... just from the readme document it looks like the precision bonus went from +5 to +100.

It will curse about a dozen troops, which is really weak for the original cost.

If it does a fixed amount between 10-14 units then it should still be 2 astral since a curse is forever. Also I believe the spell causes increased bad luck as well.
However, if the spell does a percentage based on the number of units in the province the cost should be closer to 4 or 5.

They are very situational, and both use gems that would be much better spent on other things given the original cast. Have you ever seen..

I've had or seen many many commander-types, even strong ones, vanish because of the Lure of the Deep spell. For many maps this spell is quite a deal for 40gems.

The ice devil still has it, or at least they do in whatver version of CB we're using in CoW

I hope you're right... there was one ice devil where part of his character was being immune to fire. Sad if that was taken away.


Anyone have an answer for question#5 ?

[Graeme Dice]

NTJedi said:
Graeme Dice...
I don't follow on the AIM spell... just from the readme document it looks like the precision bonus went from +5 to +100.

You can't change the bonus precision that aim provides. WHat you can change is the precision that the mage that casts aim uses to determine where the aim spell lands.

If it does a fixed amount between 10-14 units then it should still be 2 astral since a curse is forever.

A curse is also mostly irrelevant unless it's on one of your SCs.

However, if the spell does a percentage based on the number of units in the province the cost should be closer to 4 or 5.

It only targets a single province, so it's still usually not worthwhile to spend any gems on it.

I've had or seen many many commander-types, even strong ones, vanish because of the Lure of the Deep spell. For many maps this spell is quite a deal for 40gems.

Have you ever lost a game because somebody cast it? It's got an actual cost of several hundred water gems if you want it to last more than a couple of turns.

[Wish]

The ice devil still has it, or at least they do in whatver version of CB we're using in CoW

[quantum_mechani]

NTJedi said:
1) Why has AIM been given Precision of 100?? I believe the original 5 was way too low... but an increase to 100 seems way too much. That's giving a mage perfection at casting.... a bonus of 22 feels more accurate. lvl_1 alteration

Trust me, it's still plenty difficult to get it cast on the right thing.

2) Why is Baleful Star only 1 astral?? Reading the spell description I believed this spell gave a percentage chance for troops to be cursed in the target province... for 1 astral that's way too good of a deal. Perhaps I'm wrong on what the spell does. lvl_5 alteration

This was a bit overkill boosting, next version it will be somewhere between base and this.

3) I don't see why the spell heal had it's distance reduced by half. Was the spell really too powerful before?
lvl_3 enchantment

Not sure what you mean, I can't mod spell range if I wanted to.

4) Why were Foul Air and Lure of the Deep dropped so drastically in gem price?? Seems too extremely easy to get these nasty spells up. lvl_6&7 thaumaturgy

I have yet to see either cast apart from by the AI, so we'll see.

5) Why is the Ivy King more equal in stats with a Vine Ogre?? (Sea)Trolls are not more equal in stats with (Sea)Troll Kings. summoned monster

I belive many of the ivy king stats were already better than vine ogres.

6) One of the Ice Devils originally had fire immunity which is not listed in the readme text file. Why has his fire immunity been removed for that specific Ice Devil??

Possibly since IIRC his hellsword was removed at some stage of the lifedrain balancing.

quick comment: Bog Beasts should have higher morale otherwise they usually quickly flee.

I'll look into it.

[NTJedi]

aim
Trust me, it's still plenty difficult to get it cast on the right thing.

sounds fine I guess... is there any difference between eagle eye and aim ?? Perhaps a future version can make some type of difference between the two. Just a suggestion.

Baleful Star
This was a bit overkill boosting, next version it will be somewhere between base and this.

Yes consider the unrest, drop in luck and cursing of units this seemed like quite a deal. Excellent to hear the next version will have an adjustment. Do you know if the cursing of units does a percentage or a fixed amount??

heal spell
Not sure what you mean, I can't mod spell range if I wanted to.

my mistake here... I thought 10ft meant feet as in distance... now I see it means fatique.

ivy king
I belive many of the ivy king stats were already better than vine ogres.

Yes... but according to the last readme file the stats of the vine ogres for protection and defense now match the stats of the ivy king. Previously the ivy king was higher... why was this set as equal?
Perhaps +1 and -1 on each side to show a difference.

one of the ice devils
Possibly since IIRC his hellsword was removed at some stage of the lifedrain balancing.

Well just to return this one specific ice devil his character... shouldn't his fire immunity be returned? Otherwise it conflicts with the information about him.

bog beasts
I'll look into it.

Thanks for checking into this... I did many tests with these creatures but found them not useful because they would usually flee.