OT of an OT: Ethanol

[Phoenix-D]

Renegade 13 said:
Problem is, ethanol has already been thrashed to death. Neat idea, might work on a small scale to reduce overseas oil exports, not feasible as a large-scale oil replacement. Bring on hydrogen!

Hydrogen isn't an energy source. You have to produce it, either by cracking water or other slightly more complicated methods. Either way you need power to do it, which leads right around to the same problem..

[Atrocities]

Rest assured there are a lot of people, most of whom who are far more intelligent than any of us, working on the problem of alternative fuel sources. I will put my faith in their hands, as they stand the best chance at cracking this problem.

[Hunpecked]

Here's a report of a pre-processing step that supposedly makes production of ethanol from corn more economical:

http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releas...-nps032006.php

[geoschmo]

Phoenix-D said:
Hydrogen isn't an energy source. You have to produce it, either by cracking water or other slightly more complicated methods. Either way you need power to do it, which leads right around to the same problem..

This is true, but it's true for any sort of liquid fuel. Even the energy in oil came from the sun originally through the plants and the animals that ate the plants.

We aren't talking about creating energy here, just converting it from one form to another. Nuclear, solar, wind, and all the others are possible solutions for our electric needs long term when the supply of oil is gone, but unless we can come up with a practical means to store the electricity and recharge that storage quickly electricity will have limited uses as a vehicle fuel.

All forms of conversion have losses. The question is coming up with the most efficent means of conversion possible.

[Thermodyne]

I guess I’ll play the smart ***.

What about when you fuse hydrogen into helium? That gives you energy. And fuel is just stored energy, so wouldn’t hydrogen be fuel? I guess deuterium would be high test and cost more too

[Renegade 13]

Thermodyne said:
What about when you fuse hydrogen into helium? That gives you energy. And fuel is just stored energy, so wouldn’t hydrogen be fuel? I guess deuterium would be high test and cost more too

Ah why don't we just jump straight from fossil fuels to fusion! Deuterium-Tritium fusion should produce a lot of energy. Just never mind the really bad induced radioactivity of the fusion plant materials from the high neutron flux!

[Thermodyne]

Renegade 13 said:

Just never mind the really bad induced radioactivity of the fusion plant materials from the high neutron flux!

That’s why we plan to put them all in Canada

[StarShadow]

Well...we certainly have enough un-used land. Then the question becomes...would you be able to afford it when we sell it back to you?

[parabolize]

Thermodyne said:
I guess I’ll play the smart ***.

What about when you fuse hydrogen into helium? That gives you energy. And fuel is just stored energy, so wouldn’t hydrogen be fuel? I guess deuterium would be high test and cost more too

From what I know the best we got right now is a magnetic tokamak that uses way more energy to contain the reaction then what the steam turbines get out of the thermal energy produced.

Fission on the other hand is productive but puts out a lot of radioactive waste.

Wait, I take that back. The sun is a productive fusion reaction with are solar collectors, windmills and plants.

[Glyn]

I'm suprised no one has brought up Helium 3 fuel.

"Researchers and space enthusiasts see helium 3 as the perfect fuel source" He3 link

The only draw backs: Its rare on earth and there is no working reactor.