Stabilization numbers question/FCS

[harlikwin]

Well there are various threads on tanknet on the FCS capabilities of various tanks, particularly a thread on FCS I started recently that indicate that the soviet era fcs was pretty comperable in terms of functionality to western models.

Also, while I'm frankly not one of these soviet supremacists I do think they should get a fair shake, and the overal flavor of the game still strikes me as stuck in the 80's mode of horde of inferior tanks stage, which at this point from all I've read probably isn't all that realistic. Over all the years I've played SP/SPMBT/winSPMBT I think you've all done a pretty good job in most regards i.e. armor and gun accuracy and so forth, and all I'm trying to do is to get better information for the rest.

As for my descriptions: I posted my sources in the oob forum regarding specifically the T-64B/earlier T72's.

Also I've started a thread on tanknet that has some usefull information on various FCS.
http://63.99.108.76/forums/index.php?showtopic=17219

[DRG]

harlikwin said:
Well there are various threads on tanknet on the FCS capabilities of various tanks, particularly a thread on FCS I started recently that indicate that the soviet era fcs was pretty comperable in terms of functionality to western models.

******What I would be looking for is something like Janes as opposed to "various threads on tanknet"

harlikwin said:
Also, while I'm frankly not one of these soviet supremacists I do think they should get a fair shake, and the overal flavor of the game still strikes me as stuck in the 80's mode of horde of inferior tanks stage, which at this point from all I've read probably isn't all that realistic. Over all the years I've played SP/SPMBT/winSPMBT I think you've all done a pretty good job in most regards i.e. armor and gun accuracy and so forth, and all I'm trying to do is to get better information for the rest.

OK, a little background but if you have indeed been playing MBT for years you'll already know this. When Helge Bertram originally designed his Schwarzer Herzog sceanrios (28-Koenig****ter am Elm and 29 -Schandelah ) they were both classed as "expert" level sceanrios becasue both rapidly degenerated in desperate delaying actions when played as the German player because the Russian onslaught was so powerful. Then, a couple of releases later further research was done and the AP capabiliies of the NATO shells were increased becasue research showed that the original specs had made them not nearly as effective as they should have been ( and no... I don't have this raw information, this was done a couple of years ago ). Once that was changed the entire character of these two sceanrios changed. This was not done to deliberatly boost up the NATO killing power. It was done as normal research that turned up info that indicated we had undervalued the hitting power of NATO guns. It wasn't a big change as I recal but it was enough to change those two sceanrios considerably.

Believe it or not we have strived from the very beginning to ensure that ALL sides "get a fair shake". We DID NOT go into this thinking that the Russian equipment was "naturally" inferior nor were we "stuck in the 80's mode of horde of inferior tanks " The game has evolved over the years and maybe....just maybe what you see IS an accurate representation of reality but where the problem lies is the NUMBER of vehicles available to each side. The costs of the tanks in this game are strictly based on their capability. We do NOT factor "rarity" into their costs. There were a LOT more Russian tanks than NATO ones. Try ten to one odds on the Russian side and the ability to kill from the NATO side is overbalanced by the sheer number of targets and the number of those targets that return fire which was, in fact, Soviet doctrine.

This game will NEVER make everyone happy, there are simply too many divergent POV's but we have always tried to be fair

Don

[harlikwin]

DRG said:
******What I would be looking for is something like Janes as
opposed to "various threads on tanknet"

Believe it or not we have strived from the very beginning to ensure that ALL sides "get a fair shake". We DID NOT go into this thinking that the Russian equipment was "naturally" inferior nor were we "stuck in the 80's mode of horde of inferior tanks " The game has evolved over the years and maybe....just maybe what you see IS an accurate representation of reality but where the problem lies is the NUMBER of vehicles available to each side. The costs of the tanks in this game are strictly based on their capability. We do NOT factor "rarity" into their costs. There were a LOT more Russian tanks than NATO ones. Try ten to one odds on the Russian side and the ability to kill from the NATO side is overbalanced by the sheer number of targets and the number of those targets that return fire which was, in fact, Soviet doctrine.

This game will NEVER make everyone happy, there are simply too many divergent POV's but we have always tried to be fair
Don

Don:
I have looked at various editions of janes, particularly ones dealing with the older tanks. NONE of them really describe firing procedures for any tanks. They might list some model of FCS and so forth, but no real details on how it works. Also Tanknet, is at least reasonably scholarly esp when you get a few people saying the same things.

As for various revisions, I generally know how it works, I've seen it go back and forth, notice my main issue here is between two models of soviet tank that had way different FCS and procedures and have the same FCS rating. I then posit that the superior FCS might need to be few points higher because of its similarity to western FCS. As I understand crew training still plays a much larger role in the game than FCS I don't think its going to somehow massively change the game balance.

[DRG]

I'll look into this for the next release

Don

[baggypants]

Post deleted by baggypants

[harlikwin]

well the fact the said equipment pretty much does everything and M1's/Leo-2 FCS about 5+ years before they were introduced might have something to do with it. From the posters on tanknet, they said it worked quite well. Thus the conclusion.

Also, I thought the FCS mainly dealt with engaging moving targets. While other values dealt with overall accuracy (gun accuracy value)

[baggypants]

Post deleted by baggypants