Conceptual Balance (Discussion)

DominionsFan · #1 October 30th, 2006, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Kristoffer O said:
Splendid initiative Zen!

With the new spell mod commands you can have a go at making spells, changing dmg, range, effects, and whatever.

Good luck!

Fantastic! Now we will be able to make really decent mods.

Esben Mose Hansen · #2 October 30th, 2006, 11:32 AM

Disclaimer: I've never played Abysia.

For the record, I like old age. The only additional micromangement old age incurs seems to be that you need to send additional mages along for trips to avoid having the odd army without mage support all of a sudden. Playing Arco, yes, I loose a fair amounts of the old 'ones (crones?), but hey, gold is plentiful, so I just recruit some more. It just means that we won't have those insane stacks of researches hanging around, which I think is a good thing. Also, it makes the younger, less powerful mages more interesting than they were in dom2, where I virtually never hired anything but crones.

As the battlemages... the number of mages should increase along with the number of troops, so no change there. As the number of gems has decreased, the relative costs of battlefield (gemrequiring) spells has increased a bit, so that's alright. It is true that the troop buffs are more powerful now, but then, you can only have so many mages buffs troops.

One thing I would like nerfed a bit is independent archers. They are often better than the nationals, which I find a bit of a shame.

I also looooovvvvveee the new horror mark... makes it possible to bring down any SC if you are willing to sac the mages for it. Perfect!

Also, definitely move the summons around a bit so that the poor value summons are lowered to in path/research requirements and the good one the other way around, so that more summons are useful. I don't have much experience here, though. The only summon I have had any luck with are behemoths and skeletons.

Have fun everyone!

Nerfix · #3 October 30th, 2006, 11:38 AM

Abysia's problem with aging is twofold:

- Almost all mages start as old, even Anathem. Salamanders and Warlock Apperentics
- Abysians have tiny miny lifespans and are old at age of ~32. This makes them to be propotionaly more likely to rack afflictions from old age. Warlocks start with age of 38 IIRC.

JaydedOne · #4 October 30th, 2006, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Nerfix said:
Abysia's problem with aging is twofold:

- Almost all mages start as old, even Anathem. Salamanders and Warlock Apperentics
- Abysians have tiny miny lifespans and are old at age of ~32. This makes them to be propotionaly more likely to rack afflictions from old age. Warlocks start with age of 38 IIRC.

From what I recall from this weekend's game in which I played Abysia, the lower-ranked Abysian priests, the Warlock Apprentices, and the Annointed of Rhuax all begin "young". You can't say "almost all" when a full half of them don't. The choice in that nation is a hard one -- you can choose cheaper, weaker versions of each type of mage/priest without old age or you can choose more expensive, old units. The Annointed is the exception and comes with his own issue (i.e. his size, which makes him a target for AI scripting.)

Nerfix · #5 October 30th, 2006, 11:48 AM

Let me fire up the game and check...

Yes, you are correct, but A. Salamanders have age of 28(33) and will occasionaly start with old age. So that leaves us with Blood 1 Warlock Apperentices and the 440 Gold Anointeds of Rhuax as the only reliably young mages. Anointeds are great though.

This is EA Abysia. Let me see the other ages...

Nerfix · #6 October 30th, 2006, 11:51 AM

MA Abysia's A. Salamanders start Old with the age of 34(33). Their Warlock Apperentices also start Old with age of 35(35)...Their only reliable young mage is the Demonbred.

Late Era Abysia, I think that the Newst and Sanguine Apperentices are only ones who don't start as Old.

JaydedOne · #7 October 30th, 2006, 11:57 AM

Yeah, I agree that their old age might be a bit overboard, especially with the Death Resistance that I saw discussed earlier and the way it minimizes the use of the Growth scale to protect against. I know that some part of me was wondering why I was investing so heavily in mages when a full half of them were going to die sooner than later.

The other downside there is that Abysia really is an inflexible nation in terms of unit choices. Really, what else are you supposed to buy if NOT their mages?

dirtywick · #8 October 30th, 2006, 12:06 PM

Aging with Abysia MA isn't really that huge of a problem IMO. First thing is they can forge Boots of Youth, but not for a while, so mid/late game age can be a non-issue for Abysia but not most other nations. Second thing is if you're going to play them you should be blood hunting, and with blood nations you'd usually take Growth anyway which makes a noticable impact in age afflictions, although you're still going to be seeing mages die. The last thing is you'll probably be taking Order as well since their troops are so expensive, so replacing mages isn't a big deal between that and all the fire gems you get every turn and the lack of things to do with them.

Does Old Age need a bit of adjusting? Probably, I don't find it that awful except for not taking Growth bar the occasional guy who gets diseased the turn you recruit it, but in general in my experience mages last a few years.