Newbie Game EA (Running)

[Ironhawk]

Stryke11 said:
With a corner postion, more breathing space, and some time, I have no doubt the armies of Ermor would have been quite powerful. The stars didn't align this time, and I don't feel bad about it, so you shouldn't either, Foodstamp . I'm still learning as well, so next time, which won't be for awhile but eventually, I will have more useful early game "strats".

Thats the spirit, Stryke A lot of times this is just how it will work out. Even for me, as an experienced player, I am sometimes surprised (or underestimate) the power of an early rush and am wiped out in the first 10-20 turns of a game. Remember that only like 1/4 or 1/2 of the nations in any game will survive to the end to see someone declared winner Sometimes you make it that far, sometimes you dont.

On the topic of giving resources/land away when your empire crumbles: This happens in many games and you shouldnt feel bad about doing it. In fact as the game goes on it can significantly change the balance of power (in particularly getting someones treasury of gems in the later game!!!). The only thing to keep in mind when giving land away is that the nation which was winning the war may take offense at you "poaching" provinces which should "rightfully" be thiers. You are seeing this already with Vanhiem and Niefelheim above in the thread. Personally, I expect neighboring nations to poach and will not take much offense (unless it is a key province), but others players may.

[Stryke11]

Pangaea did not request the land. It was offered by the Senate and people of Ermor. Pangaea is welcome to deny the gift for their own safety if they wish, since the majority of the Ermorian people have already evacuated into their lands for safety. Ermor has ceded the land, they no longer have say as to what Pangaea wishes ro do with it, even if they do strategically give it to NH or VH.

[FrankTrollman]

Ermor can beat Van in the field just as Tienchi can beat Helhirdings in the field. It basically requires magic. Van have high defense (which is good against swords), and glamor (which is good against swords). They aren't particularly good against arrows or magic.

Ermor has crappy archery, but its magic is quite impressive. Augur Elders can spam Sulphur Mists and Archbishops are a cheap source of Smiting.

Even Huskarls cost 25 gold a piece, and once you get some magic going you can trade your troops for theirs at perhaps 2:1. That's not something that Vanheim can sustain for long. They need an early age of aggression to pay off or they are toast.

That Ermor was the victim of this particlar wave of early aggression is an entirely plausible outcome of these events. Our condolances.

The Great Catsby has Spoken.

[Foodstamp]

(OOC)

To be honest, it makes me sad in the pants that double blessed nations are allied wiping out players early game. I keep hearing people talk about these nations being terrible in middle game or late game, but honestly I don't see how, they have incredible mages as well.

I am curious to see how this game plays out and see if all these comments are right about the -heims petering out later on.

At the moment my gut instinct tells me that the fire/water bless strategy is going to be an advantage throughout the game because these nations still get pretty solid battle magic and other spells to boot.

P.S. If this is a newbie game, how can these people even comment and say "Oh, vanheim etc etc can be beat later on when you research magic etc etc".

[KissBlade]

In a straight up fight, it is true, battle mages can sway the odds. However, any player worth his salt will know to take advantage of Vanheim/Helheim's uber raiding ability which combined with a dual bless beats any pd/conventional armies. It is stoppable, but needless to say most newbie players are not equipped to do so.

[Ironhawk]

To address the comments on bless-rush nations: You shouldnt be upset that bless-rush nations are wiping out other players early. That is, after all, what they are designed to do. As to how they could possibly be weakened over time, this has to do with thier scales. Bless nations normally have to make significant sacrifices to thier scales which results in overall lower income. If you have a bless nation and a non-bless nation of comparable size it is like that the non-bless nation will have significantly more income. This in turn translates to more research (very key) and more, stronger, mages.

And to address concerns that some players may have about fighting these blessed nations in the future. Dominions always provides a way to counter any strategy. So, when faced with a superior opponent, what you should try and do is look at thier greatest strength and find a way to circumvent it. As Frank says above, the greatest strength of Vans is Glamour and High Defense. The way to circumvent this is Arrows or Battlefield Magic, which ignore defense skill. Neifel Giants greatest strength is thier hit points. But if you attack in a way that circumvents hitpoints, like the spell Paralyze or Gifts from Heaven (which does more damage than a unit and reasonably take) then you should be ok.

It is always good advice to keep an eye on your neighbors. Look at thier units and make sure you have a plan (be it with units, spells, or summons) to counter whatever attack they are likely to bring against you.

[Foodstamp]

Great advice, I will dig through ye ole spell grimoire and see what I can come up with in the event that I am next on the chopping block.

[Shovah32]

Just a little advice to counter bless rushes:
Use AoE magic, i cant stress this point enough as it is probably THE best way to deal with the 'heims sacreds.

Keep some fast response forces (which include AoE mages) to retake provinces lost to raiding and remember, just because the enemy can run away and hdie after taking a province dosnt mean they will

If you using thugs/SCs that dont have insane attack and fear then find a way to damage them that dosnt require hitting (AoE attacks like snake bladders, damage shields like charcoal shields ect)

Dont hold back. Chances are the bless nation(s) will be going at you full force to avoid a counter attack and take you out quickly, if you can push them back (most likely requiring everything you have or something near it) then you have a huge advantage and may be able to rid this world of them once and for all.

[WSzaboPeter]

First of all, I don't play Fire 9 blessing. That's good for Vans, but I think for Niefelheim Water9,Nature9 is A LOT better. Why? Fire weapons are not needed that much against most of the enemies encountered, since my giants got a pretty good strength. The problem with Niefelheim is the COST. It is true that 8 giants and 2 commanders beat your defence forces, but that was a big part of my army. For starters those 8 giants costed 1200 gold. And as it was mentioned earlier I needed some bad scales to achieve that. Without the beforementioned 9 nature bless my giants tend to be NOT cost effective. First of all, they got only 66 hp. And if I don't give them regenerative powers they tend to die, or get a lot of afflictions. The two commanders had only the purpose of blessing the giants, then keeping up with them, and hoping at least one of them survies the battle.
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In this game I learnt two things about Niefelheim. First of all, the need of two commanders, second the fact that negative luck scale can hurt A LOT. It is a lot more annoying then it used to be in Dominions 2. And drain dominion makes my very pricey researchers even less effective, so it will take ages to reach something in magic.
In the pro side, this is the second Dominions 3 game of mine, in the first one I started with an awake SC pretender, and got slaughtered pretty fast. I think the SCs are nerfed a lot. This time I started with an inprisoned one to try it. I was afread of the decision at first, but now it seems it was worth it.
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Kydorias, thanks for accepting my offer, and I'm glad peace was achieved after a missunderstanding. I hope this shows that I am able to make peace, even if my victory is assured . The next year until my pretender will awake will show that I keep my word.