[OT] More George Lucas bashing.

[Barnacle Bill]

Atrocities said:
No one can deny that Star Wars was one of the most inspirational films of the last 100 years. It blew everyone away and established the term block buster. I believe for many that Star Wars holds a special spot in their hearts that will never fade. Par none, I have seen Star Wars more times than I have seen any other movie ever made. I would still go to a Theater and watch it again if it were re-re-re-re-re-released.

Star Wars is a real undenyable WORLD ICON, one of the greatest films of all time, and should be viewed as the 10th Wonder of the world.

That said, WTF went wrong with Episodes I, II, and III?

Maybe I'm hopelessly old-time, but I'd word it "WTF went wrong with Episodes V, VI, I, II, and III?".

The original was everything you said. For years I'd have called it the best movie ever made (as I got older I granted that title to "Casablanca", but SW would still be #2). All the charm of the original was shredded in the first sequel, though.

[Atrocities]

I like Episode V, The Empire Strikes Back. Episode VI however left a lot to be desired.

I liked parts of Episode I, mainly because of the Lead Actor, but hated, absolutely despised Jar Jar and that whole Gungion BS thing that looked like something out of A Bugs Life movie.

That whole crap about the Force now being microscopic things and that Anikins was concieved without his mother having sex was just George Lucas FUBAR crap and SOMEONE should had had a pair and stepped up and told him these things would suck, but no, no one did and thus Episode II, and III were made.

While III was ok, its timing was way the hell off. Anikin and Obi fight, and seconds later the Emperor says "I fear something bad has happened to Darth." And then Obi somehow cuts off Darths legs and one arm. Seconds later, Guess who shows up.

The movie was full of plot timing errors. A sign of a truly bad director in my honest heartfelt opinion.

[Barnacle Bill]

Atrocities said:
I like Episode V, The Empire Strikes Back. Episode VI however left a lot to be desired.

Gotta disagree. The very first wrong turn was the Imperial Walkers - the importation of Battletech nonsense where it didn't belong. The big trick to armored warfare is low silhouette, and even in the original Luke's speeder demonstrated a suspention that would be great for a tank (a la "Hammer's Slammers"). All else (armor, weapons, training) being equal, a force of grav tanks taking advantage of terrain is going to wipe out a force of walker tanks sticking up like trees. It's painfully obvious that they did it because Battletech was popular with the comic book crowd about then. However, the point of Battletech was not futuristic armored warfare, but rather translating the medieval Samurai system hi-tech (i.e. not a tank with a crew, but a suit of armor for a noble warrior). That might have fit the Jedi thing, but as portrayed (Stormtrooper battle taxis) it was completely out of place.

Then there was the shift in mood from heroic fantasy to this dark... whatever you want to call it.

Finally the romance between Han & Princess Leia, with Luke conveniently removed from the triangle by being revealed as the gal's brother. Total crap. Luke was the hero => supposed to get the girl. Especially in the classic "Hero rescues the Princess" paradigm. Han, the mercenary side-kick of the idealistic hero, has no business getting the girl. At least not the Princess. If they wanted to introduce some lightsaber-waving Space-Zena, then Han could have her...

All in all, completely unsatisfactory.

[Atrocities]

Walkers are not really praticle weapons of war, they are mainly TERROR weapons.

[narf poit chez BOOM]

...Yaay for stories conforming to tired, old cliches!

That was sarcastic.

I had a longer rant, but I'm quite sure you didn't mean to imply that female characters are simply prizes to be handed out.

[Barnacle Bill]

narf poit chez BOOM said:
...Yaay for stories conforming to tired, old cliches!

That was sarcastic.

Actually, the tired old cliche is what happened in the movie - in real life the streetwise cool guy with the hopped-up ride gets the girl, not the starry-eyed nerd. So, in fantasy it should work the other way around. Inspires the nerds...

narf poit chez BOOM said:
I had a longer rant, but I'm quite sure you didn't mean to imply that female characters are simply prizes to be handed out.

Depends entirely on the story. Zena the Warrior Princess - obviously not. The Avengers - surely you jest. Star Wars? The Princess was fundamentally a plot device. A reason for the heroic dering-do. Nothing more.

[Barnacle Bill]

Atrocities said:
Walkers are not really praticle weapons of war, they are mainly TERROR weapons.

Still comes across as hokey, though...

[narf poit chez BOOM]

The nerd already gets superpowers and becomes head of an ancient order of knights.

Han doesn't even get payed, if I remember correctly.

And the princess manages to be a character in her own right at least a few times in each movie. Which is a good thing.

Now, if they really want to have bucked convention, she would have gone off with Chewie...

[Barnacle Bill]

narf poit chez BOOM said:
The nerd already gets superpowers and becomes head of an ancient order of knights.

If you truly understood nerds, you'd realize that the only point of stuff like that is to justify getting the girl. There is absolutely no point in saving the universe if it doesn't get you laid by a beautiful princess (or a reasonable facsimile thereof)...

narf poit chez BOOM said:
Han doesn't even get payed, if I remember correctly.

As a nerd who married a beautiful doctor from a family of doctors, I can assure you that getting the girl - when the girl is a beautiful princess - is much better than getting paid for taxi services.

narf poit chez BOOM said:
And the princess manages to be a character in her own right at least a few times in each movie. Which is a good thing.

...but pretty much beside the point, in the context of the first movie & a hypothetical Star Wars series that remained true to the spirit of the first movie.

narf poit chez BOOM said:
Now, if they really want to have bucked convention, she would have gone off with Chewie...

That would have gone beyond realism (as opposed to romantic fantasy) into absurdity. I supposed you could have introduced Jar Jar a movie earlier & had him get the girl, too

[Suicide Junkie]

Atrocities said:
Walkers are not really praticle weapons of war, they are mainly TERROR weapons.

When they are total crap in actual combat, they will quickly cease to be Terror weapons as soon as somebody fights back.

For example, how scary are Jaffa and their staff weapons in SG1? Sure they look scary, but when you shoot them they die, and they're big, noisy and use slow flashy weapons.

Walkers take that slow, flashy and vulnerable to a whole new level. Target practice.

Orbital Bombardment ftw