Dominion Spread

[Sombre]

I think he knows /how/ dominion spreads, he's just wondering what other players do to make it spread. As in, what are their tactics in regard to dominion.

[Jazzepi]

Sombre said:
I think he knows /how/ dominion spreads, he's just wondering what other players do to make it spread. As in, what are their tactics in regard to dominion.

Exactly. And how important people think it is from a tactical standpoint to spread dominion. IE, how high a priority is it for people to get temples up and going? Or do they just rely on preachers to shore up dominion once they've conquered an area and use them like mobile temples?

Jazzepi

[TirAsleen]

Try stealthy preachers once.

I usually play with a very high dominion and only pay for a few temples, mainly to build more priests that preach other dominions away. I buld more temples with man or panagea or if the temples give special benefits, like with ashen empire + soul gate.

[Hellboy]

Stealthy preachers could be fun, though I haven't had a chance to try them out yet (I'm expecting to soon, however). I've been thinking it would be helpful to lower the enemy dominion in advance of my troops arriving.

I'm mostly focused on MP, but relatively new to it. One thing I can say is that my initial SP practice led me astray by undervaluing dominion on my pretender. For example, I like to play T'ien Ch'i with max luck, but in a recent game with only 3 dom on my pretender, I was very much at the mercy of everyone elses dominion in the early game.

That said, I still hate the idea of paying the pretender points for very high level of dominion (like 8-10). I feel that if I do that, then I'm weaking my end game since eventually I will get my dominion up to 10 anyhow, by buying temples. There are numerous exceptions to this "wisdom" (e.g. LA Ermor), but still I think the end game is strengthened by spending less on dominion and more on scales or magic for the pretender.

So, as a player that prefers low-ish dominion (and I'd never go as low as 3 again, I guess I'll favor dominion in the 5-7 range, going forward), I like to build temples and recruit preachers. I make it a priority to put the temples and the preachers on borders of nations that have very destructive scales, and then after that I try to put temples in my rear areas, where they are (hopefully) less vulnerable to attack.

Once I have a temple, I try to preach up to dominion 3 with one or more preachers and then move the preacher(s) on to some other province. If the hostile dominion is very strong and/or my dominion is still weak, I do sometimes leave a single preacher (but never more than one) in a dominion 3 province.

If you are using this kind of method in MP play, you have to expect that you're going to lose some of your temples to a skilled opponent. As such, I always build temples in forts, and as the game goes on I try to get an ever increasing number of forts. Personally, I like playing long term games on big, spacious maps, so I'm sure that affects my priorities. In this kind of game, cash has always been plentiful in the end game and its gems that are the critical resource. As such, I never feel too bad if I lose some temples to Ghost Riders, or whatever other attacks the opponent cooks up, and I usually find it easy to rebuild temples as I need them (preferably in newly conquered enemy territory!).

[Micah]

Hellboy,

Boosted dominion doesn't affect temple spread, so your starting dominion matters late game, not the modded dominion number. Dominions isn't a game about late game potential anyhow...your late game potential is determined by your early game success and little else. High dominion spread from your temples, along with growth/death scales, are probably the 2 most important long-term considerations.

[Hellboy]

Micah said:
Hellboy,

Boosted dominion doesn't affect temple spread, so your starting dominion matters late game, not the modded dominion number.

On page 93 of the manual:
The chance of your dominion increasing in a province or spreading to an adjacent province partly depends on your god's initial dominion which you specified when you created your pretender. The chance is multiplied by your god's maximum dominion.

The example that follows in the manual makes this even more clear. So it absolutely is the boosted dominion that matters - unless there's been a rule change since the manual was printed?

Dominions isn't a game about late game potential anyhow...your late game potential is determined by your early game success and little else. High dominion spread from your temples, along with growth/death scales, are probably the 2 most important long-term considerations.

I don't know what game you're playing but it surely isn't the same one I play! Now granted, I love EA games on big maps with big magic. In this kind of game it is true that early game expansion is a big driver, but to say "little else" seems to be over simplifying, imho. And for sure saying growth/death scales as one of the top 2 long term considerations does not apply to the MP games I've been seeing.

In the games I play the primary resource and source of power in the end game is gems and the troops/leaders that you summon with them. Any kind of troop you can buy with gold becomes irrelevant, eventually. And it that environment, having death scales really doesn't hurt you a whole lot. Now to the extent that early expansion gets you better access to gems and better funds to buy your researchers, yes the early expansion is critical. However, I do not believe that the #1 expander in the first 20 turns is guaranteed to be the winner (as one might conclude from your statement "your late game potential is determined by your early game success and little else").

[calmon]

Yep the manual says a different way the game does.

Read my posts in the bug list:

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/thr...?Number=476748

[Micah]

Hellboy,

The manual is wrong. It may be a bug, it may be a change, but temple spread is unaffected by dominion increases from having extra temples.

There is no scale for increasing your gem income, or it would obviously be a more important factor than growth. Gold isn't that important late game, but building temples, castles, labs, and mages is always useful. Troops are also still used for the purpose of beating down gates, so being able to buy more troops speeds sieges along, meaning you get the gem income of a province that much more quickly.

What would you say is a more significant long-term consideration than the gold boost from growth? Some possibilities would be the luck scale, E/N blesses, or a pretender that covers the holes of your national paths. Luck is a maybe, but most of the good events give gold, or an insignificant amount of gems. The blesses are nation-specific depending on what's sacred, so tht's a tricky one. I'd support saying that a pretender that covers holes in your magic paths might be the most important consideration for late-game, although depending on what indies you find it might not be a concern.

Mostly though, as I said, it's going to come down to how large your resource pool is, which is based on early and mid game success. A 5-gem income advantage (that's about 2 provinces on a high-magic map) on turn 10 adds up to 200 gems on turn 50...if you haven't found any indies by then you can easily burn some of those on empowering if need be and still come out ahead.

And no, the best expander on turn 20 isn't always going to win, but they have the best POTENTIAL to win, all else being equal.