Morale

[Hadrian_II]

I dont say that the morale system is bad. But as i understand it, there is except from spells no way to get your morale up again, maybe if you kill enemys, you could get morale from that action so that you dont rout while you are winning.

[Lazy_Perfectionist]

What about that banner/standard bearer ability? Can't that boost your morale?

[Endoperez]

IIRC, banners don't boost morale, but make it rise to the original again. That is, they negate negative effects (Panic spells, people dying from the squad), while you'd need something like a Sermon of Courage to actually increase morale.

[Taqwus]

Wouldn't mind seeing some refinements, 'tho, ex...

- immortals taking a serious morale hit outside of their own dominion, because now... they might actually *die*

- units getting a morale bonus when retreat is not an option

- possibly, units having a -1 modifier if they fled a battle in the previous month (note: a +1 for victory would be easily abusable)

[Kristoffer O]

Banners and stuff increase morale and may even raise it a bit above original lvl. Morale tries to return to original morale level, a bit each turn. Brave soldiers loose their bravery if far from the banner, and frightened soldiers regain their lost morale if their squad is not subject to attacks or spells.

As someone said there is also an armyrout rule that makes the whole army rout when a certain amount of troops are dead or routed. Even if there are just 50 archers left they seem to have done us incredible harm, best not attack them!

[Hadrian_II]

Kristoffer O said:
As someone said there is also an armyrout rule that makes the whole army rout when a certain amount of troops are dead or routed. Even if there are just 50 archers left they seem to have done us incredible harm, best not attack them!

Does the armyrout rule just count the death troops, or does a death War Minotaur count harder than a death meaenad?
Or asked otherwise, throwing lots of chaff into the grinder might actually hurt you?

[TwoBits]

Yeah. So don't lose too much of your cannon fodder - they're expendable, but not that expendable.

Perhaps the developers need to create some kind of "morale point" system for different units. Say, a commander or an elite sacred unit might be worth the equivalent of 5 other units, while a militia/thrall/manead might only be worth 0.5.

Think Longshanks from Braveheart - "Send in the Irish, they're cheaper than arrows." No offense to any Irish folk here

Wadda ya' think, can we have that ready for the next patch?

[Ewierl]

Kristoffer O said:
As someone said there is also an armyrout rule that makes the whole army rout when a certain amount of troops are dead or routed. Even if there are just 50 archers left they seem to have done us incredible harm, best not attack them!

Personally, I've found that this rule provides some strange efeects in practice. If you have a really solid SC but a big disadvantage in terms of armies, you end up forced to keep your SC alone, since bringing any troops whatsoever raises the risk of "automatic whole-army rout" when your troops die off in droves.

I've often seen this rule produce strange tactical requirements if you're fighting with thugs and SCs. You end up needing to keep your chaff protected!

Basically, I think the "army casualties -> army rout" connection is problematic. Let squads rout individually, don't force that Gorgon to rout just because Maenads are getting chewed up by spells.

[Meglobob]

Ewierl said:

Personally, I've found that this rule provides some strange efeects in practice. If you have a really solid SC but a big disadvantage in terms of armies, you end up forced to keep your SC alone, since bringing any troops whatsoever raises the risk of "automatic whole-army rout" when your troops die off in droves.

I've often seen this rule produce strange tactical requirements if you're fighting with thugs and SCs. You end up needing to keep your chaff protected!

Basically, I think the "army casualties -> army rout" connection is problematic. Let squads rout individually, don't force that Gorgon to rout just because Maenads are getting chewed up by spells.

I would just like to agree with Ewieri 100% here. I have been winning alot of battles but my army has routed just because the chaff got slaughtered. I now place my chaff at the rear of the battlefield on guard commander/hold and attack orders. Its only there to siege castles...and suicide at some opportune moment (thus save me the upkeep), its usually the free militia/flagellants from random events.

I have found this to be a huge problem with Pangaea and maenads as well. You can't put quality units in the same army with maenads, as the maenads die so quickly your army routs at 50% casualtys. Then your quality troops are in danger as they retreat off the battlefield. Also its a huge mircomanagement pain putting the army back together again.