Dolphin - EA game - restarted

[Baalz]

Yes, when you're known to break NAPs others don't tend to honor them with you, a hard lesson about consequences I fear you won't have much time to consider. Rest assured, I had no doubt from the moment you attacked that you lacked any interest in doing other than scorching as much earth as possible. Lacking the character and ability to do otherwise, monkeys fling poo....you have to expect distasteful behavior when dealing with your sort.

[Jazzepi]

The grand people of Abysia see no need to honor pacts with pact breakers. We held our end of the NAP, gave notification, and then saw it broken against our neighbor.

Jazzepi

[Sensori]

Jazzepi said:
The grand people of Abysia see no need to honor pacts with pact breakers. We held our end of the NAP, gave notification, and then saw it broken against our neighbor.

Then you are even more stupid than we thought. If you expected us to hold true to anything which concerns either of you when you, two much larger nations than us, are breathing down our collective necks... "Pact broker" is such an idiotic term, especially when it is YOU two who wanted war.

Yes. You wanted war. You got one. Just not on your most optimal terms. Deal with it. If you ever thought that we would just go down quietly, you were stupid, naive and probably mentally retarded.

[Papastoss]

I got worked. Hard. GG

[Jazzepi]

Sensori said:

Then you are even more stupid than we thought. If you expected us to hold true to anything which concerns either of you when you, two much larger nations than us, are breathing down our collective necks... "Pact broker" is such an idiotic term, especially when it is YOU two who wanted war.

Yes. You wanted war. You got one. Just not on your most optimal terms. Deal with it. If you ever thought that we would just go down quietly, you were stupid, naive and probably mentally retarded.

I don't mind light in character joshing between nations, but you are just being offensive. This is your only warning; stop it.

Jazzepi

[Sensori]

As an OOC reply to that... Yeah, I'm being offensive. Towards the Abysians and the Sauromatians. Whom, in the view of the Lankans, spout a lot about honor while going after weaker folks, which isn't very honorable. And then they go ganging up on weaker folks, TOO, because they're cowardly. If the other side doesn't have a fighting chance, it's kinda stoopid to start talking about honor or the lack of it when talking about the other side, when they're doing things that are obviously the best courses of action for them to take before actually dying.

Seriously, if you expect people to actually honor deals, don't go, "I'm breaking this nap rofl, and oh yeah, I'm bringing a friend too just so you really can't do anything." That basically gave me the justification to do whatever I want, because I know I'm gonna die fast anyway, so I don't really have to care about anything anymore, except causing maximum damage to one of you before I really go. Remember the whole thing about the cornered animal being the most likely to bite back? And that is works for humans, too? Well, that's what happened. ;p

[Baalz]

The thing you have to realize is that by behaving utterly loathsome both in and out of the game all you accomplish is making sure people don’t want to make pacts with you in the future, or indeed even play with you - and perhaps if you’re lucky annoy some people who are playing a game with you for no reason other than mutual enjoyment. Take this advice in the spirit with which it is intended, regardless of how you justify it poor sportsmanship and being a sore looser hurt yourself more than the people you’re trying to annoy. If you behave like somebody you’d want to play with you’ll have a much more satisfying game, and indeed life. Fight the good fight, congratulate your conqueror, and see if there is anything you can learn from your defeat.

By definition its strategy to avoid a fair fight. By definition it's poor sportsmanship to cause grief after you've lost. You decide the player you're going to be.

That’s just my opinion, so don’t bother responding with vitriol as that’s all I’ve got to say about it.

[Sensori]

Hmm? You still don't seem to get that I'm playing the part of a nation that was betrayed by two nations whom it considered friendly. You showed no indication of wanting war with me, in fact you went as far to actually sign a non-aggression pact, and then, suddenly, you figured it was time to go to war and then you even brought Abysia into it. Thus you managed to make an already unfair situation extremely unfair. You left me with no other choice but to attack you the way I did, and you know that's the truth. At least you could've had the common decency to fight me on a one on one basis, when I would've done what I originally intended (bring my troops to the border, wait one more turn and attack) and I would've still lost. You're like a bully first going, "YOU'RE SO DEAD..." and when the one being bullied does something that hurts the said bully, he goes, "HEY UNFAIR, YOU ACTUALLY FOUGHT BACK." ;p

This poor sportsmanship BS is just as much BS as it was before when I got overrun by Helheim as Marverni, and I didn't even break anything there. Sure, I could instead just go "buhuhu I'm going to lose (( I quit" every time things start looking grim to me, but I'm the kind of player who instead chooses to actually fight back as long as I can with the limited toolset I am given. This IS a wargame, you know, not a "I quit the moment I realize I've lost" game nor a "I care for the welfare of people who want to kill me" game. And you know... I think getting an ALLY out into the war is far worse sportsmanship than me attacking you one turn "early". And you got Jazzepi to show the same lack of "sportsmanship" by getting him attack me a turn early, too, instead of showing that you are "better" than me and waiting for the third turn - a turn you could've waited for easily because you guys are stronger than me ALONE already. So, your complaint loses its ground.

You are quite an unpredictable player (Burden of Time as Mictlan? Christ, no one saw that one coming, and let's not forget Astral Corruption! Both are direct violations of the spirit and the letter of non-aggression pacts, cuz they screw up people badly), but you're WRONG to think that others aren't capable of using the very same element. I caught you offguard. You should be complimenting me for the fact that I actually managed to do such a cunning feint instead of going "OMG UNFAIR" - then I might actually feel compelled to compliment you for your aggressive style of play, which, for all intents and purposes, is pretty effective, while not a way of playing the game that I enjoy. I do enough of this powergaming in Anarchy Online, thank you.

All is fair in love and war, they say. But apparently not in Dominions 3 gaming, because fighting back is horriblay. To give a counterargument on one of your other points, it's you whom people should be wary of making NAPs with (I know I will be after this). Why make a NAP with a person who'll just cancel it anyway when he thinks he's ready to kill you, and brings others to do the dirty work for him? My track record so far, however, shows that I only go against a NAP that's being CANCELLED ANYWAY when I'm under pressure from much stronger nations, and it's the only way I can do anything instead of just going instadead.

I really don't think you have any place to complain here. You made your intentions clear. You got an ally with you too. I made my conclusions on them, and I did what I deemed as necessary. Abysia broke the NAP as well, and I'm fine with that. I may have broken the 3 turn rule, but you went against the spirit (and letter) of non-aggression pacts. You don't seem to take the idea of non-aggression pacts as seriously as I do - which is good to know.

/argument hat

Don't worry, I can continue this argument for just as long as you want. It's pointless, it's stupid, yes, neither of us are really standing on any ground to accuse the other of anything as we're both doing what we're pretty much expected to be doing. I'm clinging to whatever shreds of continued life in-game I can find while you are bringing the smackdown on me... All should be good. The IC chatter was just that - IC chatter. What I've said is stupid, pointless stuff from a nation of warlike demon-things that kinda look like apes which are dying under the combined might of two of the strongest nations ingame, with insults and general nastiness being thrown from both sides.

EDIT:

For those who might read this argument and wonder about it, and possibly about my reasoning for what I did, I took a few of screenshots from the graphs to make my side of this silly argument a bit clearer and probably understandable.

1) Provinces

As you can see, I have a LOT less provinces than either of them do. Even if I somehow doubled up, I'd still have less than either one of them.

2) Armysize

While this does not generally look as bad as the Province count, it actually is. As you can see, from one fight with Sauro's troops my army size dropped considerably. It's because a large majority of my army consists of ghouls/ape ghouls and assorted undead chaff with some ape archers and sacreds - I can't even dream of trying to replace all the troops I lose when I end up in a fight.

3) Income

Partly due to my horrible position (lots of wastes), partly due to the fact that they are insanely huge compared to me, their incomes, even alone, would be waaay above twice than that of mine. They could field much larger armies than I could if they wanted to as a result, and Abysia, in fact, does. He was my only hope for fighting off Sauromatia who had his army all over the place, but well, he seemed to have other ideas. His choice.

4) Gem Income

While my gem income is only slightly worse than Abysia's (which means that our gem income is totally abysmal, I've only found 2 provinces with sites that give gems outside my capital with my many searches), it is way lower than that of Sauromatia's.

[Sensori]

Hmm, so you are saying that it is alright to stoop to the level of those whom you might consider dishonorable? Hahahahaha. More jokes! You sure know how to keep us entertained. No, it in fact only reinforced our point on that attacking on the third month of the NAP cancellation, even if orders were given on the second month, was exactly what should be done, as that is what your ally did as well! And you still seem to think that we might've actually had a chance against your and Abysia's combined power... Are you completely out of your mind? Have you been using some of those "natural drugs" of yours again?

And let's not kid ourselves. Even the most retarded markata child could see that you fully expected us to defend against the armies of Abysia which piled up on our borders while YOU would get all the good parts of our lands with practically no resistance. The fact that, even while starting to cancel the NAP and claiming that your armies would roll into our lands in three months, you failed to bring any proper forces to our borders, ever. Too bad your plan backfired as we managed to get the momentum instead of you, and now Abysia is reaping the benefits while you are reaping the damage. Indeed, your tactics are without a shred of honor and are readable as though a book, yet you claim to be "honorable"... Of course you consider us dishonorable because we acted in a way that displeases you, but was obviously the ONLY reasonable action we could take. Which part of that is so hard to understand? We know we can't survive in a war against you AND Abysia. You know that. Abysia knows that. And you still think we care about your views on honor, when you have none?

Please, stop this nonsense. Haven't you heard that a cornered animal is very likely to bite? And it is true for even most sentient creatures? And why do you call us "monkeys"? You are actually related to them, while we are of completely different pedigree. Or does the fact that we use them in battle confuse you? Because, we can assure you, we are not apes. You are.