Mara - EA game for newish players - full

[sum1lost]

Totally not treacherous at all.

We just want to give the lizards a hug. An icey hug of death from the grave, but a hug nonetheless.

I'd also like to remind the lizards of our agreement prior to war.

[Warhammer]

I'd like to request everyone to do a write up of this game afterwards. I think it would be interesting.

[sum1lost]

The nation of yomi sat in their corner. At one point the men and goblins had a war with the naked men to the south. There was great slaughter, until the demons of yomi joined the field, and waves of fire, darkness, and great spinny blades swept the naked men from the field, even as the naked men sought to strike back with slings and magic punches through space.

Then, they sat around as everyone else beat eachother up, and researched and recruited more demons. Recently, they declared war on the lizards too.

[parcelt]

Sounds like a good idea (the write-up).

Yomi, that's a good start but don't bother, C'tis will be writing the rest of your history.

We will honor the agreement you mentioned.

[IndyPendant]

Here, as promised, was the game, from my viewpoint.

First, my mistakes: poor pretender design, and not concentrating enough of research leaders. Taking Misfortune-3, so that regularly 1-3 provinces a *TURN* were rebelling in some way. (Never, ever, EVER taking Misfortune, EVER again!) Not site-searching early enough. Also, constant warring is *badt*; I had to put all my resources into troops, and not enough into leaders. Caused a snowball effect causing me to be *way* too far behind on research, despite being one of the largest nations for much of the game. --Which, btw, only painted a great big target on my forehead. Causing more wars. Vicious cycle. Too many castles built, and poor positioning for one of them. Trusting *anyone* to keep their word.

Second, the whining: I've decided that Caelum's army *SUCKS*. Elephants are good for early expansion, but are too easy to rout mid-to-late game. Caelum's infantry is laughably pathetic, and their archers are only passably good. Their extreme mobility helps, but hit-and-run tactics can only get you so far; eventually you have to face your opponent's army directly, and when you do you need *at least* a 2-to-1 superiority to even have a *chance* at winning. And even then you will often lose. Eagle Kings are powerful air mages, but at 400 a pop they're hard to mass, and since my research sucked this game...*shrug*.

--And my position! It didn't help that I was the *only* player who started in the middle of the map, with *every* player as a neighbour! And! With only four neighbouring provinces to my capital--one of which was a plains, and the other a 'blank' province. Compare that to, for example, Yomi's start, which was (if I got it right) in a corner of the map, with no less than six neighbouring provinces, *all* of which were mountains and/or forests. Arguably, only Oceania's was worse. Heh. Thanks, Llamabeast...*sigh*. My opponents were all tripping over themselves for the chance to take me out before anyone else did! Corner start for me next game, please.

/whine off

[IndyPendant]

Now the game. As mentioned, I find myself starting in the middle of the map. Grand, I think: this will be a short and brutal game. I slowly build up an army to start expanding--and quickly discover I have done so *too* slowly; Marverni and Lanka both end up conquering provinces only two short hops away from my capital. Absolutely unacceptable, of course. I conquer the big, juicy Plains that Lanka took near my capital, and send a message to Marverni that essentially reads "I don't want an early war, but I can't allow you to be so close to my home province. My fault, for not expanding fast enough early game, so I offer you a trade: what would you like for these three provinces?"

Now, I'm expecting almost *anything* from "Screw you, they're mine" to "Fine, I want all the provinces south of the mountain range" to "Tithe me 100g for ten turns" to "1200 gold, up front, and they're yours" to "Join me in an early war with Yomi". Almost anything, in fact. Except what he actually did: "I think not", and conquering one of my own provinces--which was also one of my capital's neighbours, to boot!

*blink*

Well, at least we're clear. Early war it is. Time to get on the diplomacy bandwagon. I desperately scream "HELP!!!" at Yomi: "Join me in this war against Marverni, and I'll even let you take their capital!" (--This was a minor 'sacrifice' for me, btw; I've found I hate sieging castles, particularly early-game, and with size-3 Caelum. They tie up your armies for too long, and you need greatly superior numbers--something I wasn't likely to have for a long time.) Since there's no conceivable way I can survive a two-front war, I 'apologize' to Lanka, move out of 'his' Plains province I had just conquered, tell him he can take it back, and offer the standard 3-turn NAP, all the while thinking pleasepleasepleasedon'tkillme...: ) He agrees with some grumbling, and I secure 3-turn NAPs with C'tis, Tien-Chi, and Oceania. I offer the same to Hellheim, and instead he says he 'won't attack me for six turns, and reassess then'. Hrm. Interesting, that...

It turns out (I think, anyways) that Yomi was already in a war with Marverni when my message reached him. (And if that's true, then I cannot fathom what made Marverni think he could handle a two-front early-game war!) So he seemed more than happy to agree. I start gearing up for war (and thus getting even further behind in my research. *sigh*).

Over the next eight turns or so, I chase Marverni's smaller army all over my territories. Once we even exchanged places. (Let me take this moment to explain that I had misunderstood a fundamental rule of Dom3: I had somehow come to think that the order armies attack enemy provinces is determined randomly. So I should have had a 50-50 chance of attacking his army before it could attack another province of mine, right? After roughly six or seven turns of chasing him all over the map, I began to think I was--just possibly, mind you--wrong. A post on the main forums later, and I discover that indeed, I am wrong. *sigh* More wasted turns. Grand.)

At least my other mini-armies have been busily conquering his other territories--and gobbling up the gold mine of indie territories I discovered south of the mountain range! For some insane reason, Marverni and Hellheim--the only others with access to that area--hadn't moved into those territories yet. (Marverni at least had an excuse; he was busily trying to survive a two-front war he started. I can't understand what was going through Hellheim's head though!)

Meanwhile, Yomi keeps throwing armies at Marverni, and Marverni keeps destroying them. The two of them spend most of the entire war apparently fighting over the same single province, neither able to move beyond it. Right around the time I discover my army-movement mistake, Marverni makes a beeline with that smaller army right for his own capital--where another stronger army is just coming out and moving on my home capital. And all I've got nearby is a smaller indie-conquering army, and the army that had spent the last 8+ turns or so chasing him everywhere.

Hrm. Okay, *now* I'm a little nervous.

What can I do, what can I do? His merged armies will destroy mine. Hrm. Well, he's making a bee-line for my capital..and in order to do that he'll have to move through this provinces...that is three provinces away from my capital! Hmm!

I research Evocation like mad, build a bunch of flyers, and move two of my mini-armies into that province. Just before Marverni moves into it, I dump *FORTY* PD into that province, move my fliers there, all of my Eagle Kings (a whopping FOUR of them. *sigh*). Marverni steps confidently into my trap, and their army gets annihilated. Stomped on. Crushed. The only thing I failed to do was kill his pretender (awww...

And then in real life, I go away on a trip, send Llamabeast *three* messages (long story) asking him to delay the turn, announce it in the forums...and still stale out. Right when indie heroes random-event attack my *capital*, and besiege my home fortress. For two turns. And also allowing Marverni to recover a bit, starving TWO of my armies in low-supply provinces down south, etc. Grr...

Nevertheless, a few turns later, I'm by Marverni's capital, mopping him up. I make him another offer: I keep the territories I conquered, and we go to 3-turn-NAP status. Admittedly, the offer sucked for him, cuz I had taken most of his provinces--but it was his only chance of survival, allowing him to concentrate on Yomi exclusively. Beggars can't be choosers, after all. His response? "Ah, so you are growing afraid. I have crushed Yomi's army, and now I can concentrate on you!" And then Yomi sends me a message: "I think I can take him, but I need you to provide a distraction."

*blink*

At this point, over about twelve turns, I have kicked Marverni's butt from my capital all the way back to his. While he and Yomi fence back and forth accross essentially the same few territories. Yet I am apparently quaking in my boots at Marverni's vast might. And Yomi wants me to provide a 'distraction'. Uh huh. I honour my agreement with Yomi, and wait for him to conquer Marverni's capital. And wait. And wait.

And Hellheim attacks me.

--Hello, what?

[IndyPendant]

At this point in the game, I've got the most territories by far--I think I owned over 50% more than the second guy. Which, I discovered, is *not* a good position for the guy in the middle of the map. And my research sucked; I might have been at the lowest in the game. My Dominion was only below average, at best. My gem income was piddling. Etc etc.

But I had the most provinces, and so the biggest target painted on my forehead. *sigh*

Tien-Chi and Oceania, for the last little while, had been busily two-teaming Lanka and gobbling up his territories. Something I wasn't unhappy about, since Lanka and I had the worst non-war relationship of all my neighbours (*cough* can't imagine why *cough*). I was also a bit nervous about C'tis, who was sitting pretty in a corner, and quietly never fighting anyone at all.

In all honesty, I wasn't surprised that Hellheim attacked me, cuz I was his only land neighbour. I was just surprised at the *timing*. My war with Marverni was just winding down, after all, allowing me to concentrate on him exclusively--and he was *much* smaller than me, on pretty much *all* the graphs. It was like a five-year-old challenging me to a wrestling match. I offer Hellheim a chance to withdraw his forces and resume a NAP (I don't *want* another war, dammit!!! : ) but he just tells me I should retreat north.

Yeah, right. *sigh*

Shift gears. Again. (Research? Vhat iss diss ting, 'research'?) Start moving my mini-armies down south, and use my fliers' mobility to gobble up a bunch of his provinces guerilla-style, hopping about everywhere like frogs on steroids. I notice he's had even *more* of a barbarian-uprising problem than I have--and then, finally, take a look at his scales. Good gods. Turmoil, Sloth, Death, Misfortune, and Drain. ALL at 3! Wow.

I start pressuring Yomi to take out Marverni once and for all, saying I'll have to do it if he doesn't just to close up that front. Finally, Yomi tells me he's got "one last thing" to try that "should do it". Next turn he slaughters Marverni's defenders. The turn after he takes the castle. Wow. Good tactic, whatever it was...: )

Eventually, I get a large army moving down to Hellheim's castle and besiege it. Then promptly get booted out by his army and sooper-dooper 600-point-buy-or-something SC Pretender. (And yes, contrary to forum posturing, I got my butt handed to me.) Nervous again. Hellheim starts moving north. Oceania and Yomi declare an end to our NAPs.

Oh, come on! Will I *ever* get a break?!?

At this point, I would probably have been ready to throw in the towel--except for C'tis. The puppet master. The evil vizier, hiding behind the king's curtain and whispering in everyone's ears. He had been my best, quietest neighbour--not even taking advantage of no less than THREE barbarian uprisings on our common border, and entering into a lucrative trade with me over a number of turns. He messages me to say that everyone's conspiring to attack me, but he wants to enter an alliance with me. Together we can take out our enemies one by one, and only then turn on each other. All I have to do, is attack Yomi first, and he will join in. Then, I 'only' fend off everyone else attacking me while we both attack Yomi, then the others one by one. --Oh, and that I give him a 'one-time gift' of 60 gems to help solidify the agreement.

Uh huh.

I'm more than a little skeptical of a 'plan' that has me being everyone's focus while C'tis cherry-picks foes and gobbles up provinces in relative safety--but I don't have many options by this point, his plan is plausible--and just might work. Certainly, without his help I'm going down. So I agree. And then start firing dozens of private messages, to every remaining player. Feeling like I'm tapdancing over a sea of spearpoints, desperately holding the slavering wolves at bay just beyond the firelight, I try my best to carrot-and-stick discourage Yomi and Oceania in particular from attacking me. I even get Oceania to renew our 3-turn NAP--only to have him break it again. And I eye C'tis suspiciously, noting that Oceania broke it shortly after I informed my 'ally', C'tis, that we had renewed it.

Hrm.

Meanwhile, back to Hellheim. I Hurricaned his home province no less than FOUR times. Then I did the exact same thing to Hellheim that I did to Marverni: I figured he would be making a bee-line for my home province--and if so he would then attack this province here, next. I move all (and I do mean, all) of my forces to that spot, ratchet up the PD to 50(!!), change my casters' spell selection to better handle undead, and gamble a small force on attacking the one province he controls neighbouring it--so that if he routs, all die. And I *still* lose. (Did I mention how much I *DESPISE* Caelum's laughably pathetic army units?!?)

--But! I killed all but about 15 of Hellheim's units, while retaining roughly 1/3 to 1/2 of my own army and most of my leaders. Hellheim's army was kaput, at least--although he still had his mega-powerful Pretender. I knew he couldn't continue to move forward, and I was about to move the remainder of my army into that province to try to wipe him out for good...when I stopped. And considered. And realized what *I* would do in his situation--which was sneak back through a province I control, under glamour, to his home province and turtle up. So I gambled. Instead of moving to attack, I set my army in that particular province to 'Patrol', increased its PD to 20, and moved the rest of my army to that province. And sure enough, I catch one of his three remaining leaders there, destroying the remainder of his army--and, as an added bonus, catch his pretender, and slay him as well! Hellheim was finally, finally out of the game; all I had to do was mop up the remaining pieces. And it only took nearly all of my military strength to do--

Oceania attacks.

*sigh*

[fungalreason]

I played Maverni in this, and made just about every mistake you can. I thought this was going supposed to be a newbie game

Anyway... the game starts, I try to expand quickly. End up choosing to traverse the mountains because it seems like there's more room there. I probably would have done better by expanding south and just fortifying a natural chokepoint. I receive a message from Caelum asking me to turn over 3 lands. Doing so would leave me FAR behind in territories and completely cut off any room to expand. I didn't think I had any option. In fact the request was so unreasonable, I assumed his message was simply an excuse to instigate war. Therefore I decided to take a more aggressive response.

I attack, and send out messages to negotiate a NAP with the only other neighbor I knew about at that point, Yomi. Unfortunately, I was way too late on the diplomatic front. He attacked the SAME turn (Hadn't received any messages at that time, so I probably should have been more on guard).

Basically I knew at that point I was screwed. I somehow ended up 2 front war while playing a weaker nation. I also hadn't found any Indy provinces that could make scouts so I had no clue who my enemies' neighbors were. So all I could do was make forum posts and hope someone would pick up on the hint and join forces with me against one of them...

I knew my army couldn't take Caelum's head on. My initial plan was to simply avoid his troops, pillage and disrupt what I could, and research up to something that could deal with the mammoths. However, Yomi's attack forced me to pull mages off research to defend. At that point, I could only hope for luck or aid from some outside source... it didn't come.

I split forces and tried to send one squad to deal with one of Caelums armies that was marching through my lands. The Caelum strike force ended up not having enough chaff, and lost half my mages. This is when I realized my pretender was awful. I really should have gone with a SC of some sort. Mammoths just trampled everything I had. The other force was fairly successful at fending off Yomi's first wave, but having little income, and minimal research at this point made it just a waiting game. Yomi's Blade winds and fireballs sealed my fate.

Caelum offered peace when I was down to 2 or 3 lands. But I sent an antagonistic reply simply to ensure my swift demise. I was out of the game, and I was pretty sure the two of them were allied by then anyway.. so why bother?

That's about it from my end. I had fun even though I got crushed. At least I learned to spend more time figuring out and/or testing a good pretender design for nations I play

[Snacktime]

Nice summary fungal - had no idea what happened to you really, I was 100% underwater back then

Hey great idea to move to 48 hour hosting. I am pretty busy at work too and was pretty sure I would stale once this weekend as it was. Everyone accommodated my trip over Labor Day so I feel if sum1won needs more time for turns that's totally fine.

Anyway thanks Warhammer, quickhost will allow us to play faster when everyone is around, and this way the game won't be distorted by stales.

Cheers! Oceania