Red OOB

[KraMax]

Dear DRG.
Thanks for your answer.

=====================================
So. the bottom line here is that "IS-IIm" in the red OOB is NOT the "IS-IIM" modernized version. It's the 1944 version and therefore deserves to be there with that designation.
=====================================

Ok. Change year of this tank - for historical justice or create new unit.
Also in tank IS-2M - the quantity of an ammunition to 35 pieces is increased

=====================================
Which reminds me. I had a look at your Russian OOB and you only have the "IS-2M" in your OOB entering service in 1954. You do not have the pre modernized version ( which really, in game terms is virtually the same tank anyway ) So where were all the IS-2's BEFORE modernization ? I don't think they were rusting away in a field somewhere and I doubt very much they were all pulled out of service before January 1946.
=====================================

In our OOB - there are no many units which were to be inserted into it... To us 2000 or 1500 slots under units and we would make almost exact our OOB.

=====================================
As well, the history of the IS-III is somewhat clouded in mystery as well. I have read reports they were used in the 1956 Soviet invasion of Hungary and even the Czech invasion in 1968.( though the 1968 does seem a bit of a stretch! ) I have also seen info that they were all out of service by the late 1950's so there is some conflict of information here. They couldn't have been used in Hungary in 1956 if, as you have them in your Russian OOB, they were taken out of service at the end of 1955.
=====================================

You are right, IS-3 was used in all these conflicts. But there is no conflict of the information on these tanks. These tanks were modernised in 1948 and 1959 (in 1959 2 times were modernised - differed only engines among themselves and more perfect sights, etc.) After upgrade of 1959 they are name - IS-3M.

Russian source:
http://www.militaryparitet.com/nomen...abrontanki/10/
http://armoured.vif2.ru/is-2.htm

[DRG]

KraMax said:
Ok. Change year of this tank - for historical justice or create new unit.
Also in tank IS-2M - the quantity of an ammunition to 35 pieces is increased

********Noted: the ammo increase

KraMax said:

You are right, IS-3 was used in all these conflicts. But there is no conflict of the information on these tanks. These tanks were modernised in 1948 and 1959 (in 1959 2 times were modernised - differed only engines among themselves and more perfect sights, etc.) After upgrade of 1959 they are name - IS-3M.

Russian source:
http://www.militaryparitet.com/nomen...abrontanki/10/
http://armoured.vif2.ru/is-2.htm

OK, when were the IS-IIIM's taken out of service then ?

Additionally, that website you supplied says this about the IS-2M when translated

In 1957, during major repairs tanks IP-2, a number of positive developments with a view to extending their useful life and unification of a number of units and assemblies with nodes and aggregates other more modern tanks

This would strongly suggest the moderization of the IS-II to ' M ' was done in 1957 not in 1954 as you have in your OOB ( and well beyond the 1947 we had in ours.. )

Don

[KraMax]

Hello Don.

The site which you quoted - certainly exact enough, but also is not deprived errors. On this site it is possible to esteem well creation history, the basic differences, etc. Though if I am fair I do not know where here the truth, but nevertheless - here on this site: http://www.militaryparitet.com/nomen...ontanki/10/-in table IS-2M very first a cell - here it is specified 1954. This site contains the strict statistics and the general information. This site contains the help information almost on all to the technician of the USSR and Russia. This site is very often updated and regularly supported. I trust this site more. Also there is an electronic edition of magazine on the military technics let out in Russia - http://mk-armour.narod.ru/1996/03/02.htm - here too in the second paragraph is spoken about that that these tanks were modernised in 1954.

Best regards

[DRG]

And also consider if it was modernized in 1954 it wouldn't make it to the troops until 1955.

Conflicting information is what makes OOB work such a joy and one very important reason why no OOB will ever be "perfect" .

I recently found one webiste that listed Belgium as a user of the BM-30 Smerch.

Don

[KraMax]

Don
--------------
=========================================
OK, when were the IS-IIIM's taken out of service then ?
=========================================

Here that I have found about modernised tanks IS-3M:

"It is necessary to underline, that modernisation has substantially raised reliability of the tank. However its century has already been measured. After modernisation tanks went to parks where were put on long-term storage."

Also it were known that some tanks are transferred Warsaw Pact, Korea, Egypt and other.

I.e. these tanks rose in a reserve of army of the USSR.

[KraMax]

I agree that some ambiguity is. Probably that so it is put actually in armies in 1955, I have not found the information on it is on all tanks known to us and other cars, apc etc. we always took for a basis the information on direct deliveries of tanks in armies if such information at us was.

[DRG]

So, as is common with things like this, we "guess" when they went OOS.

I'm going to "guess" the IS-IIIM went OOS in 1975 though 1970 would also be a resonable "guess"

Don

[KraMax]

What is OOS?

[DRG]

Out Of Service.

[KraMax]

DRG said:
So, as is common with things like this, we "guess" when they went OOS.

I'm going to "guess" the IS-IIIM went OOS in 1975 though 1970 would also be a resonable "guess"

Don

I yet have not found such data.