Bogarus Quick Guide

[Redeyes]

It has been covered a couple of times as far as I can recall, it isn't unique to Bogarus.
In the LA Ulm, Abysia and Mictlan are just as good at it, with a couple other nations (Marignon, Utgård, Gath, etc) touching on the ability with randoms.

Oh, and it's only viable in CBM.
Without it Call Horror is much higher in level.

[chrispedersen]

It is unique to Bogarus, for a couple of reasons:

A). There's still half a secret = ).
B. No other nation than bogarus has the research to pull it off quickly. Those starets are looking at 14-15 rp.
C. Other nations have more profitable avenues to expand: Mictlan has great jaguar warriors that allows him to launch an expansion group every turn.

The best bogarus can do with occultists (hint) is one new expansion group every two turns.

Still, thats pretty good for bogarus, and *much* better than trying to use their crappy national troops.

D. You can use either an FoB B6-9E3S4 Dom 6, or a great sage. The great sage has a lot better upside, but has a lot more variability of results: A rapid unrest can hose you; The Fob does not have the upside, but the consistent blood income under CBM is exactly what you need.

E. There are several variations:
O3 Cold2, Growth3: If you go this route your income is roughly 600. Tax at 140%, and patrol the first turn, you will have the money to build your castle turn 2 or 3, whenever you take the province.

If you go this way, your income is great. I'm personally divided on where to put forts. I think you will be rushed, so you should probably look for swamps, forests or hills. But each of the cities in the clear will give you better income... (they just take 5 turns).

Figure it this way: Your entire expansion army costs 236 gp.

F: Regarding unique to CBM: I agree completely. Thats what I said in my original post, too = )
G: One little minor flavor touch. *If* you go with B9E3S4, your khysts have that *useless* blood curse...

Only it turns out that ... its actually not useless. Use the kysts to attack cavalry or enemy SCs. Sure, it isn't a big thing - but it does pretty much guarantee a rack of afflictions.....

G. A few.. other touches: Armor of souls, is only Con-2. And Longbows of accuracy are only Con-0. And .. what might you be able to do with a communion of three occultists, and hellpower......

[Illuminated One]

Ah, I think I can guess the other half of the secret.
You don't retreat from the battle, right?

I tried it and it worked quite well. The retreating cost me some precious turns of going into the same province I cleared to get to other provinces though. Was on the other hand on a very tight spot in the map, on a open map it might work quite well. And starting to pull in about 100 blood slaves per turn mid year 2 without having focused on building a blood economy is nice.

[Meglobob]

I have had another look at La Bogarus and actually it is a very powerful nation using conceptual balance mod. Also, its not weak in the early game at all and does not need a awake pretender to expand.

If you play it as a blood nation in the early game, you are actually in a position to rush someone else, with a extremely powerful cavalry army using classic mongol warfare tactics (exactly what the mongol hordes did to the romans) and magic + summoned demon hordes to back it up.

You can have quite a few pretender types but a Dormant Lady of Springs with W4 N6 magic paths and Order 3 Prod. 3 Cold 3 Growth 3 Luck 3 Drain 2 is extremely fun and powerful to play.

The prod. is too allow you to recruit your cavalry. Only recruit cavalry, no other troop type. Your cavalry armies + Call Horror spam will get you alot of provinces early game.

Growth 3 will protect your old mages and help your income and blood hunting.

Drain 2 is no disadvantage at all, given your reseach output.

Order 3 Luck 3, always a joy to play.

Your god gives you a potential SC at the end of your 1st year but thats only for emergencys. She is really there to get your clamming going, so you have enough astral gems to feed your powerful S mages. Also, she gives you access to 2 paths of magic you are weak with and of course produces free water gems. You even get a bless of +2 defence and 10% regen., astral shrouds on old mages.

You should end up a blood, astral powerhouse with powerful all cavalry armies backed up with communions which can cast alot of nastiness, further backed by demon hordes and wind guided/flaming arrows composite bow firing cavalry as well.

Very cool nation.

[chrispedersen]

If you go that route Meglobob,
mix your voi archers with the second kind of cavalry (the one with the standard).


With 200 resources (a bit lucky, 180 is more average with Prod 3)
build 6 cav and 10 voi.

Also you have a 60 admin great city as I recall, so you ramp *really* well conquering the lands around your castle. If you do so, you can go for a lower prod setting.

[Endoperez]

What is that? How don't they work?

EDIT: nevermind, I found this:

Bug: Zmey dragon has a fire breath with range of str, but *never* fires it.

[fungalreason]

It's a problem with any ranged unit that has flying, I think. (I learned not leave boots of flying on mages with bows in another game).

What I think happens is: whenever a range unit determines that it's out of range of something it attempts to move forward until something is in range. If they fly, they move immediately to the front lines and get engaged in melee. Since the Zmey have a short range to begin with, it's rare that they'll have something to shoot at on the first turn of the battle. I haven't specifically tested it with them, but I'm guessing they just fly to the front and use normal attacks if you set them to "fire closest"?

[Redeyes]

But Caelian archers behave correctly if you set them to fire?
They have both melee and bows, so I don't think there's any automatic problem with the combo.

[chrispedersen]

Good observation fungal.

But I can add a few more data points.

A. Zmeys, even if they can't fly due to Staff of storms, (I thought I would get clever) still don't fire.
B. Zmeys, even if set on body guard, with a unit plainly in range (attacking a nearby unit) don't fire.


In fact, as I said in the original - I haven't been able to get them to fire under any circumstances.

Can others confirm the question about flying mages with bows? Can we get it added to the buglist or faq?

[JimMorrison]

All ranged units that I have seen, that have Flying, refuse to fly while given Fire orders. Caelians are a perfect case in point.

Dragons are another good example.