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  #1  
Old March 25th, 2002, 04:51 PM

Bman Bman is offline
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Default Re: Opening Strategies

Everyone is talking about building cargo storage early on. I say fooey on that. If you have surplus minerals after about 10 turns in a 1-planet start then you are doing something wrong and not expanding fast enough. And during the first 10 turns your planet should be busy building space station yards and colony ships. If you waste 3 slots on cargo storage, that's 1500 research points per turn or 1800+ resources per turn you could be getting instead. That pays the mineral cost required by a working space-yard each turn! With those extra points you can expand that much faster.

In a recent MP game I conquered another empire that only had about 6 planets to my 30 when we met and I was his only neighbor. I didn't understand it, but as I landed troops on all of his planets I kept finding resource storage units.

My strategy in the early game is to operate in the red and constantly increase my resource PRODUCTION so I can produce more faster. Send out colony ships like crazy and research some combat technologies early (either ship size or weapons or shields or armor or sensors or something) so that when you make first contact you will be able to build a ship capable of holding its own.
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Old March 25th, 2002, 05:02 PM
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Default Re: Opening Strategies

Bman,

I agree totally. I have played entire 100+ turn multi-player turn games never building a single resource storage facility. The only time it's ever been an issue is while retrofitting ships, and if you plan it right it's not a huge problem. It's really not a good idea to retrofit tons of ships at the same time anyway because the enemy could pick that moment to attack.

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Old March 25th, 2002, 06:33 PM

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Default Re: Opening Strategies

*winces* yup. Trust me on that one. DON'T refit a lot of ships at once.

On resource storage- it's saved my butt more than once, especially when a loose a resource-producing world or two. Human oppponents like hitting those first. At the moment in Dimension X, I'd be broke in 2 turns without my storage facilites.

And therein lies another bit of advice: watch your flanks!

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Old March 25th, 2002, 06:35 PM
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Default Re: Opening Strategies

Thanks for the tips guys. I did build a few Mineral storage facilities and I'm glad I did. There are times when I'm building very few ships and I get massive surpluses in Minerals. Storing them makes me feel a little better

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Old March 25th, 2002, 06:52 PM

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Default Re: Opening Strategies

quote:
Originally posted by geoschmo:
Bman,

I agree totally. I have played entire 100+ turn multi-player turn games never building a single resource storage facility. The only time it's ever been an issue is while retrofitting ships, and if you plan it right it's not a huge problem. It's really not a good idea to retrofit tons of ships at the same time anyway because the enemy could pick that moment to attack.

Geoschmo




Speaking of refitting in simultaneous games, has anyone else besides me noticed some bugs in the process? I've found that it is luck of the draw if you are refitting to a prototype design on whether it works successfully or not.
Sometimes the game comes back next turn and tells you the refit failed because you can only refit to the same size hull. Well duh. Given that the GUI only lets you pick the same-size hull in the refit list I could not possibly have gotten that wrong. Sometimes it comes back and says the designs are not similar enough in cost when I *know* they are. One time (in v1.41 game) it successfully refitted my ship. The catch was the new ship I had was not one of my designs! It was an organic ram-ship design by another empire and I was not even organic! That made for a useless ship since I could not repair it!

I have never had problems refitting ships to a design that was not a prototype (ie I had already constructed one beforehand). And in the first turn or two I tend not to have problems refitting ships to prototypes.

My current theory is that when you design a prototype it does not get put on the "main list of designs that exist in the game". Then when you choose to refit to a new design, the game stores the "design number" of the design in the orders. Since this prototype design is not in the main list of designs, the refit command gets a bogus design number. When the game is processed all the new designs are added to the "main list". The the refit order is processed and the bogus design number is used to lookup the design. More often than not, the design it finds is *not* the design you specified.

I have not tested this theory, but I suspect that if I design a prototype but do not try to refit to it until the next turn, that might allow time for the design to be put in the "main list" and thus might allow my refits to succeed.

Has any one else any experince with this?
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Old March 25th, 2002, 09:39 PM
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Default Re: Opening Strategies

quote:
Originally posted by augustinetorres:
This all may sound obvious, but I'll give my 2 cents anyways.

SEIV is like any 4X game it's just a huge land grab. The key to winning is to expand, expand, expand. The best tactics won't beat an empire that has a larger economic base that can outspend and outresearch an opponent.

Build colony ships with your home planets almost exclusively. Switch to defensive ships when you have first contact - but continue to grow especially if your opponent is friendly - in a game with humans this almost always the case. The computer will invariably attack you until you get a treaty.

...



I agree. Expand. I often build 10 colonizers the first 10 turns using emergency build. After that, I scrap my shipyard and build a Mineral mining facility with my homeworld at slow build.

Someone mentioned build defense first thing on a new colony. That would depended on number of players and galaxy size and if I can guard the planet with warships or not. My typical first builds are often Weapon Platform with Missles and a Shipyard.

You want to build shipyards so you can spend resources and build more colonizers. If you feel defenseless, set your colonizers to Ram. Colonizers usually win ramming with Escorts, especially scout types with only one weapon. If you see a Frigate or better, you are probably dead, might as well cripple them before you get shot down.

Once you get shipyards at your second tier worlds, start building colonizers at normal build (two turns). Depending on your production rate, you might only be able to build one colonizer a turn at your homeworld since you have population bonus there. If you cannot build a colonizer in two turns, redesign your race.

With your third tier of planets out from your homeworld you are probably getting close to someone. After you build shipyards, start building some armed ships at those.

When you start need more resource, use one of your shiphards to build a space port, if you can do it in two turns. Otherwise, any world will do.

Once you get one colony in a system, leap frog it with the next colonizer, Let the shipyard there seed those planets. It can build cheaper 3 or 4 engine colonizers to get to those planets quick enough.

Subsequent colonies in a system can build resources or research facilities. Extra shipyards if you are near someone.

Once a shipyard is no longer on a frontier, it can start building other facilities or orbital shipyards.

Around turn 20 or 30, you need to start building more warships and escorting them as there will be lots of dangeours ships out there by then.

As for research, I have found that Point Defense are an early must, in case you meet an agressive race early on. Missles + point defenses allow you to build Weapon Platforms that make planets costly to take out. ECM I is good to have early on too. Prop 3 will make your ships cheaper. Escort and Destroyer tech are good. DUC III+ are cheap to get weapons worth going for, unless you are going for missle attack ships. You can skip the weapons/arms stuff if you think players are passive and go for Research II, Solar Panels. Construction|Mines can be achieved rather quickly, which will defend your planets even better than weapon platforms. However, that will not give you warships capable of escorting colonizers once you meet a competing race.

Something new I have been toying with, but I am not sure if it is worth it yet. A colonizer with a Cargo II component can carry a Weapon Platform with it. That saves building one the first turn of a new colony.

Trade Colonization Techs with the first race you meet. This will give you more worlds to colonize.

If the first facility you build in a system is going to be a shipyard to seed the others, consider colonizing the lowest facility world first as that colony will be too busy to build other facilities.

One final note. Cargo Specialists can maintain the population bonus while skimming off colonists for each new colonizer. You can play with a smaller construction bonsus to build 10 colonizers in 10 turns with these races. Better be sure what your starting homeworld size will be before optimizing for these.

Some advocate building orbital shipyards at your homeworld instead of colonizers. Here is the problem: It will take 2 or 3 turns to build one of these. Then it will take 3 to 5 turns to build a colonizer at one of these. That means your first colonizer leaves your world at turn 6 to 9. By turn 9, I expect my second tier to be producing colonizers already.
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Old March 25th, 2002, 09:53 PM

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Default Re: Opening Strategies

Gentlemen,

I am a short-time lurker, and first time caller, and am very new to this particular game, though I have plenty of experience in the genre.

My question regarding this game, and the opening moves is simple.

When playing SEIV Gold, do you find it more advantageous to rapidly expand to any planet that will support life? Or is it better not waisting precious initial colony ships on small planets with a very small ROI, and instead target your initial colony ships on breathable atmostphere planets -- that is assuming there are any within a reasonable distance.

Thanks!
Trajan
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