Time for a poll. (The subject is abuse)

[thejeff]

Tyrant:
The devs have said in several discussions that communion slaves shouldn't be able to cast spells while in a communion.
Any slave whose action comes before the first master casts can cast.
Thus it is listed as a bug.
It's not generally considered abusive though. People build strategies around it.

Edit: And he says it himself while I was typing.

[Tuidjy]

The reason I made the poll is that I wanted to see whether any issues are
clear cut enough so that one can assume that they are banned before
starting the game. It seems that short of editing the .2h file, every
trick has its proponents.

I guess one should never start a game before the host has listed the house rules.
Gods, I hate house rules. It may be helpful if hosts for ongoing games listed
what they consider abuse.

[vfb]

Hexedit: That's obviously cheating, and IMO is the only one on the list that should result in a ban. But a ban is probably unnecessary because the offending player will very likely disappear in a puff of humiliation.

MoD+BE: Abusive exploit. Probably good to mention that it's banned prior to any game that does not allow exploits.

BE+retreat: IMO this is an exploit, but obviously there are a bunch of people that don't agree with me. Probably good to mention rules for this one too at the game start, if you don't want to allow it in the game.

Demon twiceborn, stealing Bogus scripts, broken movement orders, etc: Same deal.

Communions, slaves casting: Did not know this was a bug! I always assumed reverse communions were intentional. KO says it's OK though .

Filling a lab with slave collars: Get a life!

VoD: I consider the doubling-up of slain undead buggy. And it makes me start thinking about game mechanics instead of the game itself, so ruins my suspension of disbelief. I'll cast it, but if I succeed against a target, I won't cast it again on the same target if he doesn't die the 1st time.

Sickle: kind of unbalanced, but not illogical that it works the way it does. Make it cursed (cannot drop) and horror mark the bearer, please.

[Sombre]

I personally think all the things in the poll are cheesy and see them all as abuse. I wouldn't much enjoy playing with someone who loved to pull stuff like that.

[Foodstamp]

As was stated above. Anything you do within the confines of the game is not an exploit. I am even starting to soften my view on the slave collar thing.

The only thing I voted yes for was hacking the files.

As your crusade continues, be careful not to ruin our game by shouting at the developers until everything is fixed to be very uniform and straight forward. One of the appeals of this game is the wacky stuff you can do. The quirks and weirdness is what gives this game character. And if you do succeed here, stay away from the Dwarf Fortress forums please.

[Edi]

Right. This has gone far enough. I'm off to bed right now, but if the tone of this discussion does not turn more civil, I'm going to start oppressing offensive posts and locking threads.

The thing is, despite the occasional flareups here, I happen to like this community because most of the time there is no need to break out the Modstick. The staff don't like to use them, but if we have to, we will.

I will refrain from giving out warnings for now, but if this crap persists in the morning when I get to work and log back in, these thing will look like somebody hit it with multiple castings of flames from the sky, gifts from heaven and rain of stones before I'm done. And that's before the admins step in. What they will do is an altogether different kettle of fish.

[Hadrian_II]

Every exploit listed except .2h file hacking can easily be fixed by altering the program code.

So the devs should either say that these actions are wanted, or fix them. (Or say they are not wanted, but they are not interested in fixing them [witch would suck]).

As for Battlefield enchantments --> why dont they just end if the casting mage is no longer around (death or routed). Or make just the damaging enchantments end, and let things like lights of the northern star and relief word even without mage.

As for sending slave collars --> why is the labspace limited, or just pool forged items to the lab before items from message, and add a way to dump items from labs without to have to equip them first (as slave collars are cursed)

VotD, twiceborn are minor glitches which are annoying, but not game breaking.

Communions, in my opinion the most difficult thing about communions is that they work until the slaves die from exhaustion, so if the slaves also cast spells, they will die earlyer. (but in exchange your army will have more artillery until the slaves faint)

So i just hope that KO says what is bug and what is WAD, and that the bugs will get fixed afterwards. *ommmmm*

[Edi]

Hadrian_II said:
As for sending slave collars --> why is the labspace limited, or just pool forged items to the lab before items from message, and add a way to dump items from labs without to have to equip them first (as slave collars are cursed)

There already is one. Go to item lab directly (not through commander's item slots). Click on item and it will bring up a list of the commanders in the province to give it to. Last commander in the list is "Throw it away". This Commander Throw-it-away is the same one that appears when you transfer items between commanders and is usually the subject of much hurled abuse when he is given a Ring of Wizardry, Staff of the Elements or similar powerful and useful item...

[Hadrian_II]

Edi said:

There already is one. Go to item lab directly (not through commander's item slots). Click on item and it will bring up a list of the commanders in the province to give it to. Last commander in the list is "Throw it away". This Commander Throw-it-away is the same one that appears when you transfer items between commanders and is usually the subject of much hurled abuse when he is given a Ring of Wizardry, Staff of the Elements or similar powerful and useful item...

Nice to know

[thejeff]

So we shouldn't ruining the game by "shouting at the developers" about things that the developers say shouldn't work like that?

None of the things in the poll are there just because they're unbalanced. They're there because they've been acknowledged as bug or at least unintended features.

So please, lose the strawman of " until everything is fixed to be very uniform and straight forward." That's not what people are talking about here. This is about exploiting known bugs.