Lords of Civilization

[MaxWilson]

Ashdod looks cool, though. Will probably need a Prod scale or two--Gileadite archers are cooler than longbowmen but cost Resource 49, and the top-line sacred troop costs Resource 88! Most important thing: the Zamzummite is a pretty cool battle mage. Decent precision (10, though no access to Air for precision boosters), some will be capable of casting D4 spells like Cloud of Death, E3F1 spells like Magma Eruption, E5 spells (with Earth Boots, which are forgeable by Ashdod) like Weapons of Sharpness and Petrify, and D3F1 spells like Banefire. They can also participate in communions with the lesser mages. A bit more expensive than Ktonian Necromancers but they fill essentially the same niche (with a better mapmove).

I might try out Ashdod.

-Max

Edit: Okay, I'll add to that. Ashdod is *seriously* cool. I hope I'm not repeating anything others have said, but here's what I saw:

Even without a pretender, they can forge boosters to get up to F5 (F6 on battlefield, think Flame Storm w/ giant-HP chaff), D6 (Darkness/Rigor Mortis/skelly spam or national summons), E5 (E6 on battlefield), and S5. National summons are interesting, and the higher level ones are incredible. The 9th level Call Merkavah spell was incredible when I tried it in a quick test game. Even naked and unblessed, the Ophanim just rolled over everything I sent them at without taking a single wound that I saw. Def 15, Prot 21, sacred, Awe +3 (or was it +6?), fire shield 9, size 5 flying tramplers with map move fly 5, I'm in love. Better than Iron Dragons stat-wise and IMHO more fun to watch ("rolling wheels of fire," heh). I didn't even do anything with the Chayot, he just stood there and watched the carnage. (Interestingly, some of Ashdod's national summons have Shattered Soul.) I didn't play much with their normal troops but they seem acceptably fun. I did note that their PD is pretty well-balanced. Nice mix of Gileadite archers, Gileadite spearmen, and Edomite somethings. PD is potentially important for resource-hungry Ashdod.

Since Earth, Death, and Astral are my favorite schools (with a smattering of Fire for the magma spells) I think Ashdod is going to become my new favorite flavor for the next month or so. Now to see how well they do at expansion...

[Taqwus]

Hinnom's bows are interesting. Range 45, damage 15 (strength not added). Expensive buggers because they're both large and armored.

National summons in both Conj and Blood schools. Summons sometimes demonic, which raises the usual problem for a non-death nation -- getting high undead leadership, 'specially for the weaker demons. Summons include a unit similar to a Succubus, but that requires N4/25 and Conj, not Blood.

[Meglobob]

Taqwus said:
Hinnom's bows are interesting. Range 45, damage 15 (strength not added). Expensive buggers because they're both large and armored.

Especially interesting as they can cast flaming arrows and wind guide very easily as a nation.

Just another part of the HUGE Hinnom offensive arsenal.

Heh, we now have enough giant races over the 3 ages to have a giant only MP game!

[MaxWilson]

Agartha, Niefelheim/Jotunheim, Hinnom/Ashdod/Gath. Am I missing any?

-Max

[thejeff]

I'm not too worried about the bows. I'd rather have a hundred flaming shortbows than the 20 or so of those you could get as easily. High gold and resource cost <> useful archers.

The chariots and giant sacreds and sacred thugs, on the other hand....


Fomoria is one other giant race

[MaxWilson]

Ashdod has slingers (7 gold, 2 res) which make a dandy chassis for Flaming Arrows, IIRC.

-Max

[moderation]

MaxWilson said:
Agartha, Niefelheim/Jotunheim, Hinnom/Ashdod/Gath. Am I missing any?

-Max

Don't forget Formoria.

Also, I've never thought of Argatha as a giant race. I guess their EA units are somewhat giant-ish.

[MaxWilson]

I think of EA Agartha as a giant race because they have sacred, recruitable-anywhere giant Ancient Ones and commanders (and troglodyte thugs) such that I have trouble imaging why you'd recruit normal Pale Ones except as chaff to screen for your battlemages.

-Max

[Taqwus]

The chariots are fairly slow -- they can trample fairly big units and do considerable damage, but against hordes of individually modest units one might be better off with 'normal' chariots with more AP.

Thugs are nasty, expensive, and pop-eating. The sacred units are much the same way, which means massing them is going to be ugly if you're playing a slow, huge-map game where pop might matter more, or if you simply like playing the vaguely benevolent ruler. OTOH, you do get astral, so you can Shroud your non-sacred random-2 mages if you took a relevant bless. You can get E2, so boots and hammers are accessible. N2 will help with the supply issues, but not the pop-eating.

Keep these units in top shape with a recruit-anywhere Healer(50) N2. Handy.

Heroes are fairly nasty -- children of the Lords of Civilization.

Haven't played around much with the proto-cavemen yet. Decent environmental resistances and constitution, darkvision 50, unremarkable skills and equipment.

Weak access to most paths (water and death excluded), usually 2s, strong in blood.

...oh, and if you do get death and start reanimating, the longdead you get include longdead Nephilim and so forth.