The (not really) Official Endgame Summon Thread!

[TheMenacer]

I had an idea for a nation of plant monsters a while back that'd rely towards the endgame on immortal freespawn, justified because they'd be tiny little fungus monsters and mushrooms just being the fruiting bodies of the actual fungus (like flowers are to plants), they'd spread spores everywhere as they walked.

It'd be an interesting idea to run with I think, just legions of freespawn that can never actually be killed and because the ones that get killed pop back up alongside the ones that're being generated every turn they gradually build up to completely ridiculous levels.

At the very least it'd switch up the endgame summon being by necessity a single large combatant because while certainly an SC could smack an army of immortal chaff with an earthquake or something, it wouldn't really matter because even if its raids paid off and the opposing player managed to push deep into your dominion, eventually he'd run into a serious army of the little buggers and be completely overrun.

Naturally they'd have to be good enough in the first place to be capable of overrunning a properly outfitted SC in any number, but hey, that's why the things that spawn them would be late game summons.


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The more I think about this, the more I think it might be a pretty awesome idea. I'm thinking like a 4N1D (because fungi are agents of decay and all) or failing that, 6N summoned immobile commander that's just like a "Fungal Web" (which is what the actual body of any given fungus looks like, an underground web that soaks up nutrients). It can't do anything at all, but it freespawns little fungus monsters with like 8 health and otherwise average-to-slightly-below-average stats that also happen to be immortal. Possibly mindless to keep them from routing when they die in droves the way they're supposed to, but otherwise mundane. They'd have a claw attack or two, and maybe if you want to get fancy something really dramatic like the ability to shoot flesh eating spores all over stuff (simulated nicely by an entangle + poison effect). Plus, I think they'd be a pretty thematic endgame option for the nature path, given this idea of nature being slow, but ruthless and persistent, with anyone trying to root it out having to be really really thorough about it or it'll just pop right back up again.

Given mindlessness to withstand mass enslavement effects, and just barely enough health to take a rain of stones, I don't see why they wouldn't be perfectly viable late game options. Anyone with more experience than myself want to correct me?

[JimMorrison]

Dunno about immortal..... It could work, but immortal free spawns might be a bit much. Now, if there were a summons that took E gems, that could Summon Allies for more mid tier units..... And those mid tier units gained free spawns..... Maybe make the larger units immortal, since they resprout from the mycellium after being damaged severely. The freespawns aren't part of the main fungal mat, so they die. But It's hard to kill off the larger myconids, so they continue gaining huge numbers of free spawns as you push them back.

And of course, there could be a few different flavors, with different roles in combat, so there would be quite some strategy in what you summoned, and how you used your national summons. But if you had some of your best summons doing Summon Allies constantly, you could have an army of mini thugs to face the incoming SCs, and they would be backed by a flowing mass of chaff that is essentially mindless, 50 Morale to really test the stamina of the enemy.

[MaxWilson]

I see one potential problem, which is that hordes of freespawn in the endgame tend to slow down turn processing a lot. So say the LA Ermor and R'lyeh players anyway, I've no firsthand knowledge.

I don't have a huge problem with immortal freespawn. Immortality is nice thematically, but is 1.) vulnerable to dominion push, and 2.) requires mobility to really take advantage of. If you kill a freespawn 6 provinces away from the capital, it probably stays hors de combat for 6 turns or so (depending on terrain). It would be not at all impossible to fight them, so as long as it's thematic I think it's fine.

-Max

[Wrana]

About fungi creatures I would add to some of them a 'Moss Body' as #onebattlespell. Though immortality would probably be too much - or at least should be restricted to just one of their kinds (I personally would prefer to make them regenerating). Another probability is Dominion summon, of course.

[Wrana]

By the way, mykorhyza (i.e., real body of fungi) is actually quite vulnerable and regrows only slowly. That's why when you gather eatible fungi you should cut them near surface, not pull them off. Just for those who didn't know previously...
(So ingame something similar should probably look as something low-hp, high MR & mindless which just domsummons chaff (or not only chaff)).

[HoneyBadger]

One of the characteristics of my own campaign setting-which is decidedly weird-is that their are roughly 15000 separate, unique fungus/crystal (traits of both) constructs that each represent a separate letter (rune, if you will) of the "magical alphabet", and that these reproduce (the reproductions are not immortal/indestructable, although the original "parent" is) over time, causing fluctuations in the presence, influence, character, and usability of the magic. These are then tended over by the setting's equivalent to faeries.

So what I'm going with this is, maybe instead of (yet another) SC, perhaps instead your fungi might produce units over time that autocast each a different specific spell. It would add something different to the nation from any other, it's weird enough thematically for a fungus nation [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/icon04.gif[/img] [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/icon04.gif[/img] [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/icon04.gif[/img] and if you set it up right, would make the nation powerful enough to compete with any of the others, due to their masses of free casters. Balance could be achieved by, firstly, making the more important "links" in the "chain" of producers very vulnerable to destruction, and by making the "chain" long enough that the really good spells-as well as any SCs and units that are very useful for other things than casting spells, don't show up until much later in the game.

[Wrana]

Yes, I agree about this, though 15000 letters "alphabet" seems too much - Chinese has fewer! It would, of course, explain magic being rare... By the way, could I look it up somewhere?
Important links vulnerable to destruction seems quite right for me, but what I'm not sure about is a possibility of making a random/semirandom NEW units production under the existing engine. IIRC mod commands allow either 'summon allies' which produces 1 type of such, or domsummon which can produce a few types with probability depending on Dominion.. This can probably include various types, but not with equal probability of each, so a variety of high-end types isn't achievable. They would also become rather common in high Dominion - and if they are free, then their production becomes completely automatic after the start, without any meaningful choice on a part of player...