Ideas how to improve WinSP MBT/WW2 !

[Marcello]

"1. Engineer tanks/bulldozers - could it be made for these to be able to push destroyed vehicles from one hex to the next one? Many times a vehicle or a number of them get destroyed and block a road, for example. I've been reading here about limited time of the battle, but I don't mean this as a recovery operation, but rather as a real battle situation. So, for example, one tank gets destroyed, blocks a road, but behind him there is a dozer tank who just moves him over to the side. I believe even in real life this would take a short time to do."

You can, if you want, give an engineer tank enough carry capacity
to load another tank. Any other way to implement this would be impossible or too difficult to be worth it.

"2. Bridge layers - I've seen there was some talk about it, but haven't seen any conclusion. I have had many missions played in the terrain crossed with small streams (one hex) which can get your vehicle immobilized (unless you go over -1 fords; there are just few of these all over the length of the stream). It would be great if somehow bridge could be erected over these short spans."

This has been discussed for years, even before these forums were created.Same answer as above.

"3. Tank transport - what's the use for these? I've never used them in a game. Is it possible to transport an immobilized tank this way?"

IIRC yes. What's the use for these? Well they exist in real life, so why not?

[Epoletov___SPR]

3. Tank transport - what's the use for these? I've never used them in a game. Is it possible to transport an immobilized tank this way?

You can transport the tank with crew inside.
I remember, what disappointment when the empty tank could not be taken away from a battlefield by this machine was.

Well to correct this lack.

[deveen]

Originally Posted by Marcello

"1. Engineer tanks/bulldozers - could it be made for these to be able to push destroyed vehicles from one hex to the next one? Many times a vehicle or a number of them get destroyed and block a road, for example. I've been reading here about limited time of the battle, but I don't mean this as a recovery operation, but rather as a real battle situation. So, for example, one tank gets destroyed, blocks a road, but behind him there is a dozer tank who just moves him over to the side. I believe even in real life this would take a short time to do."

You can, if you want, give an engineer tank enough carry capacity
to load another tank. Any other way to implement this would be impossible or too difficult to be worth it.

Yeah, I understand that, but the thing with carry capacity wouldn't be possible for destroyed tanks, right? And I guess any other way would be too difficult... Too bad. Thanks for the answers.

[PanzerBob]

In regards to your removal of wreckage question, I believe it has been an issue of time frame and scope of the game. I'm sure if Engineering Vehicles were given to ability to move wrecks, next folks would want them to dig hull down positions etc.

Frankly in modern combat an ARV type vehicle would be an expensive and hard to replace asset to put into real harms way to open a road in the time frame our battles occur. These assets do that stuff later once the frontlines are far removed from the offending vehicle. I feel your pain brother! More than once has a bridge as a great example, had brewed up armour sitting on it slowing my race across to secure to other side. I've thought, " If only I could order someone to "push that junk off the bridge!" alla Col Hessler.

As for bridge layers, I do believe they could be cobbled together using barge carriers and barges, something which is in my long list of things to do. If I manage this I will post for sure. Again I believe the game scope has made it a non issue and besides if needed a bridge can be laid and regular stone bridge could double as such, MAYBE someone could add a bailey type bridge into the bridge types for building maps, that would make me happy. I have in the past used a rail bridge as a Bailey.

Tank Transporters, can be handy to move slow tanks to the battle area and move damaged ones to the rear. This might be useful especially in a campaign. Personally you’d need a large map and likely a scenario in the 40’s or 50’s to make these worthwhile because in a modern battlefield these would high value interdiction targets.

The other reason for their inclusion would be for scenario building. I suppose one could use this argument for the inclusion of bridge layers as well.

Man, I love this game!!!!

[thatguy96]

Originally Posted by PanzerBob

As for bridge layers, I do believe they could be cobbled together using barge carriers and barges, something which is in my long list of things to do.

This does not work, at least for bridging actual water hexes. I've tried it many times myself. A single water hex will be ringed with 6 "shore" hexes. While a barge can unload onto shore without moving into the shore hex, it must be actually on the shore hex to load the unit. Therefore the "bridge" requires at least 1 point of water movement. A craft in water without at least one point of water movement sinks anyhow, further compounding the problem. I'm not sure if the barge script allows the unloading of a unit into an adjacent hex when on a "land" hex of some sort (such as a stream or canal hex). However, it would not be able to load a vehicle unless it were in the same hex (I believe), which would also render the concept pointless. Lastly, to add in an AVLB "barge carrier," one would have to overwrite the default "barge" unit in the OOB with a bridge, removing the option to buy basic barges.

In short, I think we're stuck with barges and GSP-like items. Things like the GSP "ferry" bridge section exist in a number of armies, and are much more feasible than actual bridges.

[TLAM_Strike]

I was thinking about the larger sea going LSTs that can carry 10-15 MBTs and 600 troops and was wondering if there was any way to add that.

For example if a unit has a carry capacity of 450 it can carry 150 pts of units with no size restriction, 550 is 250 etc.

[thatguy96]

Originally Posted by TLAM_Strike

I was thinking about the larger sea going LSTs that can carry 10-15 MBTs and 600 troops and was wondering if there was any way to add that.

For example if a unit has a carry capacity of 450 it can carry 150 pts of units with no size restriction, 550 is 250 etc.

They'd also have to be about 3.5 hexes long The carry capacity limit is hard coded, and I have to assume that if it was just a matter of setting it to a really high limit it would've been done by now. Maybe not. A little more carry capacity would be nice, but I don't see it happening.

[DRG]

[quote=thatguy96;635149]

Originally Posted by TLAM_Strike

The carry capacity limit is hard coded, and I have to assume that if it was just a matter of setting it to a really high limit it would've been done by now. Maybe not. A little more carry capacity would be nice, but I don't see it happening.

You won't.

255 is the highest number you can enter for carry so anything with the capacity to carry a tank for example is limited to 55 carry points(255) Something that could carry light guns and men could be set to 199 and they would carry 99 points of men as would something with 99 carry. The first of the three numbers is the code to carry guns ( 1) or vehicles ( 2 )and once you get to the 2's you run into the maximum number ( 255 ) and that's why all the barges are usually 255

The only way to make that higher would be to tear the code apart and start over. Pretty much everything anymore is "tear the code apart and start over" becasue we've pretty much done everything else that doesn't involve tearing the code apart and starting over.IF we did decide to tear the code apart these games are dead becasue we wouldn't be using any SP code anymore and the restictions we are under becasue we are using SP code would disapear.

Andy and I discussed this years ago before the Windows upgrade and weighed the pros and cons. Had we decided to scrap the existing format we wouldn't be having this chat becasue there wouldn't be a winSPWW2 or a winSPMBT to wish it had this or that different and given the sheer number of hours it would take to rebuild a game to the same level we wouldn't be discussing that game either becasue we'd only be half way through development.

In a way a lot of this is interesting because the longer it goes on the more it looks like discussion forum wish lists after SP1 was released.

The more things change the more they stay the same.

Don

`

[DRG]

Originally Posted by thatguy96

The carry capacity limit is hard coded, and I have to assume that if it was just a matter of setting it to a really high limit it would've been done by now. Maybe not. A little more carry capacity would be nice, but I don't see it happening.

You won't.

255 is the highest number you can enter for carry so anything with the capacity to carry a tank for example is limited to 55 carry points(255) Something that could carry light guns and men could be set to 199 and they would carry 99 points of men as would something with 99 carry. The first of the three numbers is the code to carry guns ( 1) or vehicles ( 2 )and once you get to the 2's you run into the maximum number ( 255 ) and that's why all the barges are usually 255

The only way to make that higher would be to tear the code apart and start over. Pretty much everything anymore is "tear the code apart and start over" becasue we've pretty much done everything else that doesn't involve tearing the code apart and starting over.IF we did decide to tear the code apart these games are dead becasue we wouldn't be using any SP code anymore and the restictions we are under becasue we are using SP code would disapear.

Andy and I discussed this years ago before the Windows upgrade and weighed the pros and cons. Had we decided to scrap the existing format we wouldn't be having this chat becasue there wouldn't be a winSPWW2 or a winSPMBT to wish it had this or that different and given the sheer number of hours it would take to rebuild a game to the same level we wouldn't be discussing that game either becasue we'd only be half way through development.

In a way a lot of this is interesting because the longer it goes on the more it looks like discussion forum wish lists after SP1 was released.

The more things change the more they stay the same.

Don

`

[deveen]

Originally Posted by thatguy96

A single water hex will be ringed with 6 "shore" hexes. While a barge can unload onto shore without moving into the shore hex, it must be actually on the shore hex to load the unit. Therefore the "bridge" requires at least 1 point of water movement. A craft in water without at least one point of water movement sinks anyhow, further compounding the problem.

What about streams/fords? Have you tried that?