OT: US President (US Dom Players only)

[Cor2]

Am I the only one voting for Cynthia McKinney? I luv her

[Cor2]

one more thing,the republicans DID steal the elections, twice. But the democrats let them, so who cares?

[licker]

Originally Posted by Cor2

one more thing,the republicans DID steal the elections, twice. But the democrats let them, so who cares?

Proof?

Seriously, everyone knows both sides cheat, and while that doesn't excuse any of the behavior pretending that one side actually holds some kind of moral high ground is simply not based in reality.

Obama and McCain are both qualified to be president, but neither seemingly brings what this country actually needs to pull it out of the funk it is in.

Leave aside the foreign policy concerns and focus on the internal issues, and explain how either of them actually address anything in a substantiative way.

McCain is no Bush, he is no continuation of the past administration, honestly, Obamas tax plans are actually closer to Bushes, but that's neither here nor their, since neither of them have what it takes to actually fix the system, all they do is pander to the public with useless band aid type fixes when a tourniquet is needed.

Obama tells you he will give you a tax break... never mind that the people he is promising this tax break to already pay zero income tax (not all of them, but the majority), so the claim that he is redistributing wealth is accurate. McCain is telling you that the wealthy and corporations need a tax break to keep job growth strong, never mind the evidence which suggests that this economy has more serious issues with the credit market in the first place making these tax cuts meaningless and likely damaging.

Yep, neither one is preaching any kind of sanity when it comes to the economy or the budget. Both are trying to scare you into thinking the other one will be worse, when the clear facts are that neither is going to be good.

So keep on voting for bad and pretend that that because your less bad is better than the more bad somehow you are doing good.

Or take the step and actually vote for a party or candidate who is not beholden to the existing power structure, vote for real change, vote for something actually good.

[NTJedi]

Originally Posted by licker

Yep, neither one is preaching any kind of sanity when it comes to the economy or the budget. Both are trying to scare you into thinking the other one will be worse, when the clear facts are that neither is going to be good.

I completely agree

[JimMorrison]

Let me clarify, NTJedi. I don't believe that income taxes are in actuality the means to solve anything, flat or not. The system is much less abusable if we designate a specific point in the flow of currency in which to tax it.

Since I believe that this is not the individual, but rather the business, then we still come to the same point - McCain wants to reduce taxes on large businesses.

I believe the true answer to taxation, is to only tax the execution of business transactions - and never from the side of the individual. Therefore, income taxes and sales taxes would be removed. Taxes on the corporate side would be increased to balance the equation. Stated wages would obviously decrease, however we would no longer have this smokescreen of saying "didn't you know the top earners pay 65% taxes??", when obviously many of us know that those people pay much less than that (and supposedly, sometimes none at all).

To extrapolate from this, if all taxes were shifted to the business side of the economy, and few if any loopholes or deductions were left in place, then the average American should see their tax burden lightened, because if the stated relative balance between high/low income remains the same, the rich will be getting less than they did in the previous system. In effect, you will have a flat tax as far as the individual is concerned, because unless everyone is willing to watch the disparity in stated earnings grow even wider, with more and more billionaires, and more and more people at and below the poverty line - then the system will simply be measurably better than it was before.


We enacted income taxes in 1913. At that time, the bottom tax bracket (and it was easy to even still be exempt, at that time, due to low earnings) paid 1% in income taxes. The top bracket, paid 7%. Many would agree that sounded like a somewhat sane idea. However, considering how badly abused the system has become, and imagining that the same effect could have been handled by simply balancing existing taxes, rather than creating new ones - I am hard pressed to argue for anything other than an abolishment of federal taxes on the individual at all.

[NTJedi]

Originally Posted by JimMorrison

The system is much less abusable if we designate a specific point in the flow of currency in which to tax it.

I believe the true answer to taxation, is to only tax the execution of business transactions - and never from the side of the individual.
...

We enacted income taxes in 1913. At that time, the bottom tax bracket (and it was easy to even still be exempt, at that time, due to low earnings) paid 1% in income taxes.

Taxation of only business transactions is another solution, but we'd have to eliminate the current tax system completely to remove all the loop holes. In any case the tax system is a mess and benefits the wealthy and very wealthy... tax cuts or tax increases on the wealthy won't be changing their lives or our lives.

Originally taxes were suppose to exist only during times of war, unfortunately government corruption/greed existed even during these early years. Government today is so bad I have government letters arriving in the the mail telling me to only expect 70% of my social security and I hear its worse for younger generations.

The country does need change, but we'll see less change from someone with a strong history of avoiding issues by voting "present", instead of making a choice.