New Patch?

[Suicide Junkie]

Very well, the answers i see:
*Decrease the damage
*Increase the ROF to 2 (IMO best solution)
*Make it more difficult to reach (say physics lvl2, astrophysics lvl1, Energy Stream/Pulse Weapons lvl3)

My way was to remove it as a unique weapon.
Instead, it becomes an "upgrade" for other standard weapons. You get the same weapon properties (ROF, range, size, cost, etc) , but 80% or so of the damage, and a phased damage type.

Phased energy + Energy Stream (APB) = PPB
Phased energy + Torpedoes = Polaron torpedoes
Phased energy + Missiles = Polaron missiles.

[Master Belisarius]

Hey Andrey, I agree 100 % with you about the possible ways to fix the PPB.

About new tools to balance the weapons using mods, are fine with me too.
But... sorry guys, I like to play SE4 mostly with the original tech tree and unmoded weapons… then, I want to play a balanced game without need to mod myself the weapons.
If the argument is: "Why cry if you can change the weapons for yourself?" (and for example, mod the Ionic Dispersers to allow again destroy engines skipping shields), then, my answer is: Why was fixed the Ionic Disperser and don't fix the other unbalanced weapons? Why change the original tech tree if everybody could fix the ID at their own taste?

[Deathstalker]

"quote:
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Originally posted by Q:
Oleg this is not possible: you can only have one damage type for a weapon and the types are hardcoded. You may choose "skips all shield" (there is no "skips phased shields") but then you will have no "engines only" damage. Or you choose "engines only" and then you must accept what MM changed: that this weapon will not penetrate shields.
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This is not possible, yet. We have proposed a change that would allow multiple damage types. Malfador has responded positively, but that's not the same thing as being sure it will be added. cross fingers.

Geoschmo"

This, IMO, would ROCK. Add in a CompEnhancement (weapon mounts) that would be triggered by research not ship sizes and I would be in heaven!

[Taera]

SJ - brilliant idea!
Just some more work:
Lvl2 physics is still requied, it opens an expensive (50k?) technology called "Phased Technologies" (something like that), which will also make a new tech tree - phased shields aviable.

LVL 5 APB + Phased Technologies = Phased Beam Weapons
LVL 5 Torpedoes + Phased Technologies = Phased Todpedoe Weapons (that'd be cool)
LVL 5 missile (expensive but hey, those are MISSILES!) + Phased Technologies = Phased Missile Weapons

Neat!

Mephisto or any other BT, could you propose the general idea to MM? I realy think that phased weapons should be moved back to their secondary/special/support/fighter killer (yes) level.

[Q]

I do understand the importance of balance and I agree on most of the proposed changes you made...

but...

do you really want MM to spend their very limited time on this while so many other important improvements have been proposed that can only be realised by them??

A "consensus group" of experienced modders could create a "neostandard" mod that would give more balance and would be widely accepted as is now the TDM-Mod. This could be based on polls on this forum. But be warned: like the task of Sisyphus this work would never end!

[Taera]

I did not say that. I have only said that the thing could use some balancing should be proposed to MM. I didnt say that they should do it at once.

A question that is bugging me is does SEIV have multi-requiement technologies? I do not remember seeing one in my games (i've never reached full tech but still).

After all, all the changes can be done by a group of modders and then presented to MM and all they will do (of course if they do like the idea and will want to implement it in future patches) is simply copy-paste the right lines to the right place and release it as the next Version of the game.

As several other people here i prefer to play the standard "mod" because IMO it makes it a little more challenging to adapt to a system you havent invented and where not everything is just how you would like it to be. Still the two most powerfu... no, i should say useful and efficient weapons were the ID and PPB. Now that ID is 'fixed' only the PPB remains. Once it is fixed, i will have no other major complaints about the technologies. Crystalline weapons remain, but thats less urgent IMO.

[oleg]

I like the way PvK balanced PPB in Proportion' mod: He basicaly made PPB to follow APB tree than MB tree. Namely you have 10 levels of PPB at 5k cost. Low-level PPB are very weak. To get high level PPB one must spend about the same number of research points as to good phase shields.