Units with stupid weapon choices

[Agema]

Originally Posted by Wrana

I meant needle ones - such as Russian Mosin-Nagant rifle had. I don't remember any "sword" bayonets except French ones - and these were used in trench warfare quite handily - without affixing them to rifles!
An offtopic question:
Agema, how well current M-16/M-4 plastic details withstand rough handling and/or using them in hand-to-hand? And another one - what are you supposed to do in case when dirt/dust gets into the barrel of any of these? (these appeared in recent off-line discussion with friends)

Sword bayonets were also standard for the British forces in WWI. They were designed to work as a short sword (or long knife) separate from the gun, they were about 45-60cm (18-24 inches) in length with point and blade. I don't much about needle bayonets to be honest, I assume they were sword bayonets without the blade.

It seems inconceivable to me that the plastic details of assault rifles can't manage rough handling. I don't know about the M4/16, but the British SA-80 can be used fine in melee and bayonet charges and the plastic bits don't fall off. I don't own a gun so I'm not well up on cleaning barrels, but there will be plenty of Googleable sites telling you all about it.

[Wrana]

Originally Posted by Agema

Sword bayonets were also standard for the British forces in WWI. They were designed to work as a short sword (or long knife) separate from the gun, they were about 45-60cm (18-24 inches) in length with point and blade. I don't much about needle bayonets to be honest, I assume they were sword bayonets without the blade.

Thanks, didn't remember this. Needle-types were standart in earlier era but retained their deadliness, of course. Their business part looks like stiletto or epee blade flowing into "neck" joining it with a ring around the barrell:

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(I don't have picture on hand, so you can look it up - plenty of Russian troops photos at both world wars will show these). Ii was forbidden at Hague convention iirc, but main reason, I think, was that they were less useful at trenches than in open field

Originally Posted by Agema

It seems inconceivable to me that the plastic details of assault rifles can't manage rough handling. I don't know about the M4/16, but the British SA-80 can be used fine in melee and bayonet charges and the plastic bits don't fall off. I don't own a gun so I'm not well up on cleaning barrels, but there will be plenty of Googleable sites telling you all about it.

I wanted info from actual user, not from plenty of sites!
As for plastic butts - there were some grumbling on this at least for early M-16s. Still, plastics got better in the interim, so maybe modern ones are all right... (as for inconceivable - one guy who served in Israeli army got his rifle's (M-16) butt break in pieces when it was dropped on the floor! Of course, the rifle wasn't any new so probably it won't matter often.)