OT: Starcraft II and Elemental

[sector24]

It bugs me that all of the "it's not ready" threads get locked, even the constructive ones. Usually with the response, "Beta 4 isn't release" with the implication that all the awesome is just lurking on the horizon waiting to explode all over your screen.

Through the whole development process (almost a year now) in my head I was expecting it to not live up to expectations. But my heart was hoping against hope that it would be awesome. I guess we'll see next week, the beta players may get a copy of the game a couple days early and provide some early reviews. But I can't see it being a replacement for Dominions, Civ, or even the old school quality titles (MoM, AoW). I can't even imagine what the game would be like if they decided to release it in February.

[Gandalf Parker]

Those get locked HERE?

If you mean on the official forum by the games publisher then I wouldnt consider it surprising. They have no reason to appreciate "its not ready" posts. Even the constructive ones. They would tend to have an overriding interest in upbeat posts prior to release. That might be irritating, but I wouldnt consider surprising.

But there are plenty of other forums and newsgroups having that discussion.

[llamabeast]

My plan for Elemental is to wait a year, then get it. I reckon they will have it all sorted by then, and the modders will have corrected any of the egregious failures of judgement that Brad is sometimes prone to.

Has anyone played "Distant Worlds"? I just stumbled across it - looks like it might be pretty awesome.

[Knai]

I had high hopes for a while, but they can't seem to get criticism. Even when they do things that are completely stupid (The Empire and Kingdom dichotomy in troop enhancement and such.) the fan base worships them, and if someone raises a legitimate criticism they are either shot down by the mods or everyone else on the testing forum. Its getting eerily similar to Pathfinder in that regard really.

[sector24]

Originally Posted by Gandalf Parker

Those get locked HERE?

If you mean on the official forum by the games publisher then I wouldnt consider it surprising. They have no reason to appreciate "its not ready" posts. Even the constructive ones. They would tend to have an overriding interest in upbeat posts prior to release. That might be irritating, but I wouldnt consider surprising.

But there are plenty of other forums and newsgroups having that discussion.

I meant Elemental threads on the Elemental forums. And I'm not surprised either, I'm just bothered by the behavior. I didn't think my post was that unclear to be honest.

I am just thinking that if I were Stardock and I made this awesome gem of a game, I would let the beta community ooh and ahh all day long. The only reason (in my estimation) to hide features and lock threads is to obfuscate the fact that it's not all it's cracked up to be.

[Foodstamp]

Originally Posted by sector24

I meant Elemental threads on the Elemental forums. And I'm not surprised either, I'm just bothered by the behavior. I didn't think my post was that unclear to be honest.

I am just thinking that if I were Stardock and I made this awesome gem of a game, I would let the beta community ooh and ahh all day long. The only reason (in my estimation) to hide features and lock threads is to obfuscate the fact that it's not all it's cracked up to be.

It usually goes like this:

Guy 1: Man this game is not ready to be released. It is not fun, buggy and is nowhere near polished.

Guy 2: STFU you retard! Beta 4 is nothing like release! It is going to pwnzer and you are dumb and stuff.

Me: Hey, you probably shouldn't call that guy a retard just because he is critical of the current state of the game.

Guy 2: LAWL you are retard too for thinking it is not ready.

Frogboy: The betas are nothing like the actual game we are going to be releasing; you guys were really playing the beta for another game.

Guy 2: LOL told you so dewdz.

Guy 3: LOL noobs Stardock tricked you noobs into thinking you were playing teh Elemental Beta.

Thread gets locked.

Rinse, repeat.

[Gandalf Parker]

Originally Posted by Foodstamp

It usually goes like this:

Not bad. Also to be figured into it...
Game changes gained? zero
Game suggestion now on the "I will never consider that" list? one
Game sales lost due to browsers and lurkers who stumble across the thread? unestimable
Time lost trying to get the programmers back to excited motivation about the game? well worth noting

I also love the reference to the perfectly good suggestion being shot down by the fan base. Meaning that most of the people didnt seem to agree with the wonderful suggestion.

There is a reason that game suggestions go thru a middle man. IF you really have something you feel should be considered then it should be sent to the publishing company so that they can present it in a way that can get it considered. Something that most forum members SORELY lack.

[sector24]

It is my understanding that Stardock is both the developer and publisher on this one, so I'm not sure what you are getting at. Even if someone else was publishing Stardock's game I don't see it would help to explain game mechanics to people who don't actually make the games. What is the publisher going to care about your ideas?

Even the constructive threads are full of fail though. For instance in one thread the guy posted suggestions for making the magic system better, because basically right now the elemental damage spells are identical and the spells lack distinctiveness. So he gave all these great suggestions, then got mobbed by the fanbois and the thread got locked. Stardock chose to have this open beta process; the least they could do is listen to the people that pre-ordered their game and did their best to improve it. Again, not surprising but it bothers me all the same.

[thejeff]

I think that's the point. Why have an open beta if you're not going to listen to the feedback? Is there a mechanism for suggestions from the beta testers to "be sent to the publishing company"? Or is that company's forum the mechanism?
If you don't want criticism in public, don't do the beta test in public.

Sure, lock the threads that are like the faux example above, but listen to actual suggestions and give some indication that you're listening. If it's not really a test, just a way to generate positive word-of-mouth, then it's kind of annoying.

It could be partly the fan base though. If anything but raves turns into a flame war, then that's a harder problem to deal with.

[Lingchih]

Stardock is well known for having open betas, and then not listening to the feedback. Still, they are the top developer of TBS games in my book, and their AI's are top notch. I will try Elemental... it looks like a poor man's Dom3, crossed with MoM.