Proportions Version 2.4 released

[PvK]

Originally posted by Baron Munchausen:
My gosh... even a fanatic can't have played a game on 2.3 before this update. This update rate is far faster than even the betas coming out of Malfador. Is it stable now? Can we play some games?

Rollo's an impressive fellow!

Yes, I think the AI in 2.4 should play Proportions better than the AI in the standard game plays the standard set... which both is and isn't saying much.

I recommend starting a game versus the AI and then finding a PBW game. Humans will always be more interesting, and IMO Proportions gives many more options for humans to be creative in empire design, unit/ship design, colonial development, and maneuver and deployment than the standard game.

I do have plans for two more layers of improvement, though. One is to provide an AI that has some cheats to compensate for its inherent weaknesses, and the other is to add some things taking advantage of the new mounts in the impending Gold patch. Both of those changes will require me to break backward compatibility, though. Still, I think 2.4 is pretty polished and should make for interesting games. I'm imagine some people will find bugs from playing it, though.

Oh, and there is one issue with Proportions AI and Gold 1.67 that I couldn't fix without breaking backwards compatibility: In Simultaneous Movement games, the AI won't build any colony ships for about four years (40 turns). It seems to be a hard-coded thing under investigation, hopefully to be fixed for the next Gold patch. It does fine in Turn-Based Movement mode. Meanwhile, work-arounds for simultaneous mode include running the first 40 turns without human control, or running the first 40 turns with humans obeying a house rule to not build colony ships, or just give the AI a Low bonus, which should more or less balance it out.

PvK

[Pax]

Originally posted by PvK:
There is no Proportions for 1.49. There are some important new features in Gold that allow some things that would not be possible in 1.49.

... and now, a brief visit from Oni no Snippage ...

It would be so much work that it makes no sense compared to the price of Gold, and Gold is really worth the cost to upgrade!

PvK

Oh well, I guess I'll just have to wait a month or two before being able to try out yoru mod then. LOL, at the rate you've been updatign it, by then ... you'll be up to Version 3.x or maybe even 4.x ... heh!

[ZeroAdunn]

All right, what am I doing wrong?

I downloaded the latest patch, installed it, didn't work.

Downloaded the latest full Version, installed it, didn't work.

I have tried everything, but it still doesn't work.

I keep getting this error: "Unknown value "Insert ship type" for entry ## type in record exploration, not connected etc...

Anybody else see this? Anybody know why this happens? Am I just an idiot?

[Sinapus]

There is a minor error in the Jraenar general file. The "Race Opt 3 Characteristic" 6 and 7 have 2 instead of 3 in it and it causes an error when reading that file.

Specifically, the part in question is:

Race Opt 3 Num Characteristics := 7
Race Opt 3 Characteristic 1 Type := Cunning
Race Opt 3 Characteristic 1 Amount := 120
Race Opt 3 Characteristic 2 Type := Defensiveness
Race Opt 3 Characteristic 2 Amount := 110
Race Opt 3 Characteristic 3 Type := Intelligence
Race Opt 3 Characteristic 3 Amount := 120
Race Opt 3 Characteristic 4 Type := Aggressiveness
Race Opt 3 Characteristic 4 Amount := 110
Race Opt 3 Characteristic 5 Type := Physical Strength
Race Opt 3 Characteristic 5 Amount := 120
Race Opt 2 Characteristic 6 Type := Political Savvy
Race Opt 2 Characteristic 6 Amount := 115
Race Opt 2 Characteristic 7 Type := Maintenance Aptitude
Race Opt 2 Characteristic 7 Amount := 110
Race Opt 3 Num Advanced Traits := 0

[ July 14, 2002, 04:00: Message edited by: Sinapus ]

[Sinapus]

Originally posted by PvK:
I do have plans for two more layers of improvement, though. One is to provide an AI that has some cheats to compensate for its inherent weaknesses, and the other is to add some things taking advantage of the new mounts in the impending Gold patch.PvK[/QB]

Anything like some way for the AI to use atmospheric converters effectively? The best I've been able to do is add a "Level 0" converter that is cheap and has the conVersion time set at several hundred turns. The AI will eventually reach the right tech level and hopefully upgrade to the right machine, or eventually will end up reaching the end of that long conVersion time and get the atmosphere converted anyway.

Problem, of course, is that a human player can choose to use them as well, though IMHO one is better off using that facility slot for something like a research center to provide more points to discover other things and eventually get up to Planet Utilization 7-9. My own personal rule is that I'm allowed one planet in my home system to have one of them as a "testbed" and have to wait until I get the appropriate tech to convert other planets.

(My initial design actually set the conVersion time for 200 turns, and it works rather well... now to increase the time and see what happens when the AI gets around to researching the appropriate tech. Hopefully it starts upgrading a few worlds here and there....)

[PvK]

Very strange. It sounds like it might be that your extraction problem didn't extract them to the files to the right place, or something. This is not the same thing that Sinapus pointed out with the Jraenar, which only occurs about once every dozen games.

What Version of SE4 are you running? What is the exact text of the message, and which file is it complaining about? When does the error occur?

PvK

Originally posted by ZeroAdunn:
All right, what am I doing wrong?

I downloaded the latest patch, installed it, didn't work.

Downloaded the latest full Version, installed it, didn't work.

I have tried everything, but it still doesn't work.

I keep getting this error: "Unknown value "Insert ship type" for entry ## type in record exploration, not connected etc...

Anybody else see this? Anybody know why this happens? Am I just an idiot?

[PvK]

That's an interesting idea. Seems like you should be able to mod it if you give the atmospheric converter facility the same family as some other facility that gets built early on. Following several other facilities in Proportions, it could be a combination facility, such as Resupply Depot with Atmospheric Converter, or something. If it shares a family number with a common facility, and has a higher Roman numeral than others, the AI should upgrade to it once it gets the tech. The problem there, however, is it won't be smart enough to realize that it does not need the component, so it will upgrade to them even on correct-atmosphere planets.

Another idea is like what you suggest, but combined with a racial tech area so that only the AI can use them, and then yes, give them a high time period before they take effect.

It could probably be advantageous for the AI, but I also wonder at the idea of having all AI converting all their colonies' atmospheres... hmm.

PvK

Originally posted by Sinapus:
Anything like some way for the AI to use atmospheric converters effectively? The best I've been able to do is add a "Level 0" converter that is cheap and has the conVersion time set at several hundred turns. The AI will eventually reach the right tech level and hopefully upgrade to the right machine, or eventually will end up reaching the end of that long conVersion time and get the atmosphere converted anyway.

Problem, of course, is that a human player can choose to use them as well, though IMHO one is better off using that facility slot for something like a research center to provide more points to discover other things and eventually get up to Planet Utilization 7-9. My own personal rule is that I'm allowed one planet in my home system to have one of them as a "testbed" and have to wait until I get the appropriate tech to convert other planets.

(My initial design actually set the conVersion time for 200 turns, and it works rather well... now to increase the time and see what happens when the AI gets around to researching the appropriate tech. Hopefully it starts upgrading a few worlds here and there....)[/QB]