Cloaking question

[jimbob]

Ooooh My head.

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~~

I read the entire thread... if only I'd started with SJ's Last posting.

[dumbluck]

Originally posted by Ed Kolis:
Hmm, I've run into another snag... What is the point of a level 1 cloak in anything but EM-Active? According to what I read in the manual it seems such a cloak would have no effect unless there were a level 1 scanner in EM-Active - ships start with level 1 scan in EM-Active and level 0 in everything else, right? Or do they start with level 1 in everything? If that were true, then you'd need a level 1 cloak in everything in order to be invisible from even the lowliest satellite! But there's no level 1 EM-Passive scanner, or level 1 Psychic scanner... all the scanners start at level 2. So what IS the point of a level 1 cloak in something other than EM-Active?

Ok.

• Your ship has no scanners. EM-active detection 1, 0 to all other types.
• I put an EM-active cloak on my ship, which grants EM-2 cloak.
• Now your ship can't see mine.
• You put a temporal scanner level 1 on your ship.
• Now you can see mine again, even though I have a cloaking device. I need temporal cloaking 2 to be able to hide again.
  

That is the usefullness of level 1 scanners. (Except for EM-active lev 1, of coarse. They come standard on all ship hulls. Is that moddable?)
Now tell me, did I completely mis-understand your question?

[Ed Kolis]

Good, that's what I've picked up from this thread. So now I have Em-Active scanners going from level 2 to level 5 (so they can detect ships in nebulas with cloak level 5, and mines with level 5 stealth), and all the other scanners go from level 1 to 4. And the various cloaks go from level 2 to 4. That should work...

[dumbluck]

In that case, your highest scanner will beat your highest cloak.

Just out of curiosity, why don't you have any level 1 cloaks (for the other cloak/scan types)?

[Ed Kolis]

Originally posted by dumbluck:
In that case, your highest scanner will beat your highest cloak.

Yep, isn't that the way it works in the unmodded game?

Just out of curiosity, why don't you have any level 1 cloaks (for the other cloak/scan types)?

Well, wouldn't they be useless? A level 1 scanner could see through them...

[Phoenix-D]

"Well, wouldn't they be useless? A level 1 scanner could see through them..."

But since a ship (probably) doesn't have all level 1 scanning by default, you still need to install the scanner.

Phoenix-D

[Ed Kolis]

Well, what exactly would a level 1 cloak block? A level 0 scan? I don't think that level 0 scans count for seeing things with... or DO they?

[Phoenix-D]

It would block a ship WITHOUT scanners from seeing the ship- assuming they don't start with scanners in everything, of course.

Phoenix-D

[Krsqk]

Let's see if we can simplify this:

code:

---

         Actv  Pass  Grav  Temp  Psyc

Scanner    1     0     0     0     0

Cloak      2     0     0     0     0

  --Cloak wins



         Actv  Pass  Grav  Temp  Psyc

Scanner    1     1     0     0     0

Cloak      2     0     0     0     0

  --Scanner wins



         Actv  Pass  Grav  Temp  Psyc

Scanner    1     0     0     0     0

Cloak      0     1     0     0     0

  --Scanner wins



         Actv  Pass  Grav  Temp  Psyc

Scanner    1     0     0     0     0

Cloak      2     1     0     0     0

  --Cloak wins (EM), redundant cloaking

---

Level 1 cloaks won't provide any benefit, since lvl 0 doesn't detect anything--lvl 1 is the lowest effective level. Thus, the lowest practical cloak level is lvl 2, since level 1 is redundant.

[dumbluck]

Why is Level 1 redundant??? If a ship starts with 0 in everything but Active EM, then level 1 will hide you, IF you also have a higher cloak in Active EM. If my Active EM cloak beats your scanner, it may be quicker for you to research, say, level 1 Passive EM sensors than it would to research level 2 Active EM sensors. Either way would let you see my Active EM cloaked ships, but If you're pressed for time, the quickest sensor that would defeat my cloak is best.

And splitting cloaking/scanning techs up like this would have the fringe benefit of making Scanners more useful. (How else are you going to be able to remain undetected and yet know for sure that you ARE undetected...

[ August 03, 2002, 08:54: Message edited by: dumbluck ]