British Special Forces small arms 2017

[Mobhack]

The SLR was invented solely so that NCOs could inflict "pokey drill" on squaddies if there was any spare time.
https://secure.flickr.com/photos/164...07/6841172936/

Oh the sheer fun of holding 11 pounds of rifle out at full extent, with the first to drop before the NCO called the change getting a good shouting at.

(Actually I seem to recollect it more in the first few weeks of joining, perhaps they used it as a screening method to see who would stick things out or not. )

[IronDuke99]

Yes I do remember doing that, although I don't think I ever 'lost' that.

I do remember, as a teenager, very early on in training leaving my rifle three yards away while I answered a call of nature. A grizzled veteran of a training Cpl charged me with my rifle and 'bayonetted' me in the stomach several times with it bloody hard while calling me every foul name under the sun.

My rifle never, ever, left my person in the field again.

[DRG]

Originally Posted by IronDuke99;836667

[I

My rifle never, ever, left my person in the field again. [/i]

And that is precisely why that lesson was taught the way it was. Doing things that can get you killed ( or your Cpl killed) are frowned upon

I do not envy the job recruit training NCO's do ESPECIALLY in western democracies

[IronDuke99]

Originally Posted by DRG

And that is precisely why that lesson was taught the way it was. Doing things that can get you killed ( or your Cpl killed) are frowned upon

I do not envy the job recruit training NCO's do ESPECIALLY in western democracies

Agreed and one of several reason I do not favour women in front line infantry units.

[Suhiir]

Originally Posted by IronDuke99

Agreed and one of several reason I do not favour women in front line infantry units.

Hey !
I represent that remark !

As long as a female can meet the same physical standards as the males I don't see a problem (and only 10-25% can). I TOTALLY hate the idea of any sort of dual standards system.[/quote]

Originally Posted by DRG

OOPS....I hit "edit" instead of reply........my bad

[Mobhack]

Originally Posted by Mobhack

The SLR was invented solely so that NCOs could inflict "pokey drill" on squaddies if there was any spare time.
https://secure.flickr.com/photos/164...07/6841172936/

Oh the sheer fun of holding 11 pounds of rifle out at full extent, with the first to drop before the NCO called the change getting a good shouting at.

(Actually I seem to recollect it more in the first few weeks of joining, perhaps they used it as a screening method to see who would stick things out or not. )

I'll just necro this post since https://www.youtube.com/@britishmuzzleloaders has just done a nice video on good old pokey drill!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0AXZm0iTRM

For the good old SLR, there are some Rhodesians waving them round near the start, but the vid focuses on pokey with the No. 4 rifle.

Britishmuzzleloaders is a very good YouTube channel, mostly based on British black powder and then bolt action era kit and period drills and uniforms etc.

[Suhiir]

I certainly don't expect to see any women in the SEALs (and while "GI Jane" was an amusing movie get real), Green Beenies, or Force Recon anytime soon.

But I was, and am, an oddball and exception. I'm 6'2" (yeah, a freak of nature) and grew up as the oldest child on a farm. At 18 I was in FAR better shape then 75%+ of males and 95%+ of females. While I'm hardly a FemiNazi I always remember a scene in the movie "GI Jane" ... where they're swimming and a black guy tells her she's just the first nigger on the block like his granpappy was during WW II.

[IronDuke99]

Originally Posted by Suhiir

I certainly don't expect to see any women in the SEALs (and while "GI Jane" was an amusing movie get real), Green Beenies, or Force Recon anytime soon.

But I was, and am, an oddball and exception. I'm 6'2" (yeah, a freak of nature) and grew up as the oldest child on a farm. At 18 I was in FAR better shape then 75%+ of males and 95%+ of females. While I'm hardly a FemiNazi I always remember a scene in the movie "GI Jane" ... where they're swimming and a black guy tells her she's just the first nigger on the block like his granpappy was during WW II.

There are always occasional exceptions, but the fact you had a USMC career, starting, if you will forgive me for saying so, some years ago, surely shows that the system was already working well enough for the small number of women who were interested in a military career and able to meet the physical requirements.

I think women can do excellent, and vital, work in areas like intelligence, etc. I don't think they belong in close range hand to hand fighting, trying to lug 60lbs of kit around mountains and c...p in plastic bags in fire trenches, etc.

Men need to behave, and think, in a certain way to be effective warriors. A great many women tend to want to change that pattern and their presence tends to disrupt it. There is also the fact that men will do stupid things to try to save/shield women in combat, that they would not do for a male comrade. All that stuff is a result of millions of years of evolution and no amount of desire for equality is ever going to change it.

There also seems to me to be a huge disconnect between the feminists who constantly want women protected from men in civy street -often on highly dubious factual grounds- and then women being put deliberately in the way of people who will gladly kill them very dead indeed in the most vile and nasty manner they can think of.

I was just watching a video of a female UK Police officer being attacked by an Afghan in UK with a hammer and her terrified screaming was very upsetting to hear, her male oppo was also attacked but did not do any screaming and eventually rescued her...

[DRG]

There will always be exceptions and obviously, you are one of them but 6'2" farm girl's wanting to be Marines are ( from my comfy perspective.. ) few and far between and I think what it comes down to is how the bar standards are being lowered to be "inclusive". "Equality" is only achieved when EVERYONE is judged by the same standard and we move further from that every day it seems

Don

[Suhiir]

From my experience the biggest problem most females face (ignoreing those that just don't have the right mental attitude and expect the military to conform to them rather then them conforming to the military) is hips.

Most women have issues with their biologically wider hips (compared to overall height) when it comes to running and walking distances with a load. Sheer physical strength is a fairly minor issue. Lots of smaller guys in the military aren't as physically strong as some women. Overall guys have the advantage, duh, but it needs to be looked at on a case-by-case basis under the exact same standards.

My "issue" is generalizations. Most females aren't suited to the military life, but to exclude all females based on that alone is what reasonable people, of both genders, object to. Again, I suggest we ignore the radical elements on both sides.

As to evolutionary psychology, I'm sorry, but that's an excuse not a reason. We're not governed by some inherent behavior pattern, we're influenced (strongly) by societal expectations. And those are what need to change. Just like the ones that for centuries dictated that the unwashed masses needed to be governed by the social elite (kings or priests) because they were incapable of doing so themselves.