What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies

[MarkSheppard]

Another issue for 2025 and onwards is that we're seeing datalinks proliferate to the ground user.

One of the big reasons Ukraine's offensive slowed down was because of the KA-52 Black Shark fleet; specifically the newer model -- Ka-52M which has the LMUR (ЛМУР -- Легкая многоцелевая управляемая ракета) Legkaya Mnogotselevaya Upravlyayemaya Raketa, lit. 'Light Multipurpose Guided Rocket'.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LMUR

The LMUR is a big boy -- 100 kg and a 25 kg warhead (versus Hellfire's 50 kg and 9 kg warhead); but what makes it so dangerous is that it's the first real "digital/datalinked" weapon the Russians have and it has an extremely long range of 14.5 km.

LMUR has two modes:

Mode 1: The target is marked by the operator before launch, and the carrier helicopter can turn away directly after the missile launch -- essentially "fire and forget" Hellfire logic.

But what's new is Mode 2.

Mode 2: The missile is launched by the Ka-52M without on-board target lock. The LMUR flies towards a point selected by the operator; with GPS guidance and transmits what it's seeker sees back to the launching platform. The operator can then look at what the LMUR sees and select a target (or change it) while the missile is flying towards it.

LMUR is the only Russian ATGM capable of this -- and this Mode 2 is the only one in which it reaches the 14.5 km range.

In Ukraine, the Russians have used UAS Drones to spot enemy targets, with the target location/information being passed on to nearby Ka-52Ms who launch their LMURs into the blue (for them). This is extremely effective, because the Ka-52M can destroy targets without exposing themselves personally to Ukranian air defenses and LMUR's 14+ km range means they can stay out of range of a large portion of Ukranian air defenses.

Ukraine now has received an ATGM that operates upon the same "datalink" principles:

https://www.armyrecognition.com/defe...o_ukraine.html

On November 9, Défense & Sécurité Internationale posted a tweet broadcasting a short speech by Lionel Royer-Perreaut, a member of the French National Assembly, during a hearing of the Defense Commission dedicated to the French military assistance to Ukraine. A delivery so far unnoticed, he confirmed the supply of Akeron MP ATGMs, among other weapon systems consisting mainly of Mistral air defense missiles, CAESAR self-propelled howitzers and TRF1 155mm towed howitzers.

Akeron MP operates much like LMUR -- Mode 1 (Fire & Forget) or Mode 2 (Post-Launch Targeting) -- so while an individual Akeron ATGM operator may not be able to see a target; he can be told via other methods that there's a target, and launch into the blind and target after launch.

[DRG]

Originally Posted by MarkSheppard

In Ukraine, the Russians have used UAS Drones to spot enemy targets, with the target location/information being passed on to nearby Ka-52Ms who launch their LMURs into the blue (for them). This is extremely effective because the Ka-52M can destroy targets without exposing themselves personally to Ukranian air defenses and LMUR's 14+ km range means they can stay out of range of a large portion of Ukranian air defenses.

The game already allows this .( more or less)

A recce Drone can be used to call in an NLOS weapon and a NLOS weapon can be carried by a Helo

...... the combination is very effective

What we don't have are Russian NLOS weapons and we don't use NLOS weapons as off-map assets

EDIT

What I can say now is off map NLOS units can be built and they work REALLY WELL with drones and they also Counter Battery very well

As in "Thunderbolts from Thors hammer Mjölnir" well

[DRG]

Originally Posted by MarkSheppard

One of the big reasons Ukraine's offensive slowed down was because of the KA-52 Black Shark fleet; specifically the newer model -- Ka-52M which has the LMUR (ЛМУР -- Легкая многоцелевая управляемая ракета) Legkaya Mnogotselevaya Upravlyayemaya Raketa, lit. 'Light Multipurpose Guided Rocket'.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LMUR

The LMUR is a big boy -- 100 kg and a 25 kg warhead (versus Hellfire's 50 kg and 9 kg warhead); but what makes it so dangerous is that it's the first real "digital/datalinked" weapon the Russians have and it has an extremely long range of 14.5 km.

LMUR ?......... If that thing doesn't get code named ELMER I will be very surprised