Mod: Pythium, the Second Empire

[Burnsaber]

Okay, I made a new version to quickfix the Theurg Artisan and the Theosis summon. I also wanted to get the Cultist intoruduced as soon as possible.

I'd like to hear feedback about two things though that concern me about this mod. They might be abusable.

1) Pyrotes. Although they sometimes fail comically they can really bring things down fast. Could they be abused in MP? The obvious counters to them would be fire magic (duh) and fire resistance and they could kind of be countered with combat summon spam (phantasms, skellies, swarm) becuase the more they have to attack, they more chances they have to fry themselves or their allies.

2) The holy communion spells. The biggest concern for me at the moment is the H8 "Divine Wrath", which is basically renamed "Ark" effect. If you really wanted to, you ceould kind of get it fast with the prophetized Emperor, PoS and 8 communion slaves. The thing about the ark is though that if you don't want it fry you, you can only use Battle Vestals with the communion which makes the whole army kind of fragile. Perhaps I should make it researchable, like the "Calling of the Seventh*"?

* Has anyone tried it out? I made it researcable because you can get it out pretty fast if you want to and dealing with Michael is pretty hard in the early game, especially because he will most likely eat any awake SC pretenders/early thugs alive very easily.

CHANGES FROM 0.7 TO 0.8

-> Theosis made more expensive and harder to cast
-> New commander: Cultist, replacing the generic assassin
-> Now compactible with LA Pythium
-> Pyrotes gold cost to 35 gold (from 30gold)
-> "Divine Protection" spell grants now elemental resistances too
-> Principe gold cost reduced to 14 gold
-> Theurg Artisans got more randoms

Originally Posted by Stavis_L

Burnsaber - had an idea for your more angel-centric Pythium. Perhaps you could use the modified unit type target of Ritual of Rebirth to allow Pythian martyrs to return as (lesser) angels? Perhaps an Angel of the Heavenly Choir or Angel of the Host?

Sounds cool, but I want to keep spell slot usage to a minimum and I don't really think that this Pythium would really get much units to the HoF in a game. Also, it would be kind of dumb to re-awaken a regular Archangel or Harbinger as a weaker angel. It would be kind of nice to have that option, but it wouldn't really get much use.

Originally Posted by Sombre

Does this overwrite MA pythium then? I'd prefer to see it behave like Ulm Reborn or Jomon Broken and be able to act alongside them, to play out mirror universe / civil war style conflicts.

Yes, because a lot of my motivation for this mod comes from the power level of Pythium and I really think that it should be nerfed. IMHO, it's espicially annoying, because MA is the most balanced era (Ashdod does not exist in sensible games) and Pythium really sticks out like a sore thumb there.

I also really like the fact how it uses absolutely minimal modding slots, especially with the increasing amount of mod conflicts people are getting nowdays. If someone really, really wants to see some real Pythium vs Pythium action, they can make the mod for it themselves (it's pretty simple). That kind of matchup would be pretty dumb anyways, because this nation is a lot weaker than the orginal, so the outcome would be pretty clear. The orginal nation has higher astral (mind duel anyone?) and better communions (better masters for them), so it would really just be a slaughter. Actually using this mod would actually boost regular Pythium with the boosted angel summons this mod provides.

Originally Posted by Sombre

I don't care about stuff it interferes with in other ages tbh, since I like the ages to be clearly divided.

Well, to be honest, I don't really care that much either. But I kinda like LA Pythium (although the sacred hydras are really dumb, IMHO, they should be summons) so I don't want this nation to break it. Besides, fixing the compactibility issues was pretty trivial.

[WraithLord]

In my test game I can't recruit battle vestals. Are you sure they're there?- If so, I'm probably experiencing a conflict with another mod.

Also I can recruit varangian cap. as a unit.

[Burnsaber]

Originally Posted by WraithLord

In my test game I can't recruit battle vestals. Are you sure they're there?- If so, I'm probably experiencing a conflict with another mod.

Also I can recruit varangian cap. as a unit.

That's very odd.

Do you have any other mods enabled than CBM?

Also, it might cause odd behaviour if you enable this mod before enabling CBM (I have a warning about that in the OP, but it can be easy to miss).

So, when enabling this mod, enable CBM first and after that the "Pythium, the Second Empire". This is because the mod overwrites mmany CBM changes so it has to be enabled last so that the game reads it last.

[WraithLord]

Yes, I enabled the mod after CBM.
I have diversity and sprites mods on as well, I'll try w/o them.

[Jack_Trowell]

Principes seems overpriced at 15 gold. They only have slightly above average stats and equipement. The tower shield is of course good against ranged attacks, but the medium armor means that arrows that aren't blocked will often wounds the unit. And gold cost is not supposed to be about equipement but stats, and for what I see, for supposed "elite" units, theyr only get a few 11s instead of the base human 10.

As such, 12 gold each would seems like a better price, but maybe I am missing something about them ?

[Sombre]

Does this overwrite MA pythium then? I'd prefer to see it behave like Ulm Reborn or Jomon Broken and be able to act alongside them, to play out mirror universe / civil war style conflicts.

I don't care about stuff it interferes with in other ages tbh, since I like the ages to be clearly divided.

[Sombre]

It should be living in peace with it anyway provided CBM was enabled first, so I'm confused.

[WraithLord]

I can send my system spec, game files etc. if it helps. Don't know what's more effort, to put this mod after CBM or try to debug strange conflicts like I have.

[Burnsaber]

Originally Posted by WraithLord

I can send my system spec, game files etc. if it helps. Don't know what's more effort, to put this mod after CBM or try to debug strange conflicts like I have.

A new version and I made a version of the mod that also includes CBM 1.6. I also used this chance to do a small update and made the "Divine Wrath" spell reguire research (just to be on the safe side, castable "Ark" effect is nothing to sneeze at, even if it reguires H8 to cast). Another update was to make a "Secrets" file for this mod, like I have done to Bretonnia and Dwarfs.

So now, in the graphic folder (called "Byzantine") of this mod, there is a a .txt file called "Pythian Secrets", which explains the many nuances of the mod and effects of the spells in gameplay terms. Warning though, the file could be considered as a spoiler fest, but good for players who do not want to second guess what a spell actually does.

[rdonj]

I am with burnsaber on the alchemist vs artisan debate. You don't really need huge numbers of alchemists. You DO want to hopefully get a few artisans for each path. If you get more than you need you can use extra s guys as site searchers, same with water ones if you can make water bracelets at the time. You'll want some of those anyway to let them forge higher path items, boost alchemists, etc. And since it's really just the alchemists and the artisans competing for the capitol mage slot, I don't think it's really a big problem.