OT_ MOO3 - Page 2

Lemmy · #11 September 3rd, 2002, 06:31 PM

regarding civ3, the 8 civs are only for the expansion pack, not in the patch.
AFAIK the patch only fixes some bugs, and completes the editor.

sachmo · #12 September 3rd, 2002, 06:37 PM

It's gonna suck! Too bad people will still buy it...

Baron Munchausen · #13 September 3rd, 2002, 07:00 PM

Well, I don't actually have Civ III yet, so I must have mis-remembered. If it's the expansion pack that has the 8 new civilizations that's fine. I'll be buying Civ III soon, and maybe I can buy a package deal with both Civ III and the expansion pack in a single purchase.

Sachmo, you think MOO 3 will suck? I think it'll be 'MOO 2.5' as some have been calling it -- not much of a real change in design or play from past 4X games -- but having what is essentially original MOO (it is more like original MOO than MOO II) with updated art and some new wrinkles to the game is not a bad thing.

Fyron · #14 September 3rd, 2002, 09:26 PM

BM, Civ3 is definitely not worth paying more than maybe $20 for (including the expansion pack).

sachmo · #15 September 3rd, 2002, 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Baron Munchausen:
Well, I don't actually have Civ III yet, so I must have mis-remembered. If it's the expansion pack that has the 8 new civilizations that's fine. I'll be buying Civ III soon, and maybe I can buy a package deal with both Civ III and the expansion pack in a single purchase.

Sachmo, you think MOO 3 will suck? I think it'll be 'MOO 2.5' as some have been calling it -- not much of a real change in design or play from past 4X games -- but having what is essentially original MOO (it is more like original MOO than MOO II) with updated art and some new wrinkles to the game is not a bad thing.

I got the impression that the game is experiencing massive feature creep, and since Infograms has absolutely no problem pushing an unfinished game out of the door, it will be less than expected. Perhaps "suck" was a harsh term...how about "disappoint"?

I'm just not sure my little brain can take ANOTHER classic game being ruined. If they get it finished, no matter how long it takes, then it will have a chance. However, that's not the way software development works anymore.

gregebowman · #16 September 4th, 2002, 08:08 PM

Well, I do have CivIII, and I can't wait for the expansion set to come out (which should be next month). I'm also waiting for Rollercoaster Tycoon 2, which is also scheduled to come out next month. These 2 games, plus Sim City 4 (if I meet the hardware requirements) are about the only games that will take me away from SEIV. There's just not enough time in the day to play all of these games!!

[ September 06, 2002, 18:58: Message edited by: gregebowman ]

klausD · #17 September 6th, 2002, 02:21 AM

Baron,
I am sorry. I dont think you are right if you say that MOO3 is rather a Moo2,5.
Just imagine the radical change of the tactical combat. Its real time! (One reason I will not buy this MOO3 game.)
This game will be rather like a more complicated shogun or medievial, not like MOO2. They just took the background and some races/names of MOO2.
I said it often before and I will say it once more. MOO3 will never reach the qualtity of MOO2 or the SE series.
There is a long row of similar unlucky game experiments like: MAX II, Deadlock II, Age of Wonders II (yes!)....-and I hope NOT SE5

bye
Klaus

Baron Munchausen · #18 September 6th, 2002, 03:27 AM

According to information posted on this BB forum, yes, SE V will have 'real time' combat because the RPG spin-off -- which is 'real time' -- will be a test/proof of concept for the combat portion of SE V. As long as it is ONLY the combat part of the game I don't think this is a big deal. One of the problems in making combat 'fair' is initiative. Something close to 'real time' (at least, many very small turns) is really required to make combat fair for smaller, quicker ships. Depending on how it's done I think it can turn out much better than the current system. Combat in MOO II was the one thing that was really better than original MOO, btw.

[ September 06, 2002, 02:28: Message edited by: Baron Munchausen ]

Puke · #19 September 6th, 2002, 08:06 AM

as long as it has strategic combat mode, so we can still put 20 players in a game and run 4 turns a week.

more complex, detailed, and inteligent orders for strategic combat would be nice too. i could care less about tactical or realtime, unless having the solid tactical backend helps the game render better strategic combat.

klausD · #20 September 6th, 2002, 10:54 AM

Baron,
"only" real time tactical combat? for me this is not really just only. tactical combat is for me 50% of SE4. I love to test my ship design against those of my opponents. (in TB combat of course)

I like the SE series really much since they start (I think I was one of the first who cought up the Modding and limited resources discussion in the SE mailling list several years ago) and I hope that Aaron will not "develope" the game in this new trendy "real time" direction. Why changing a system which is functional and well introduced? Improving yes - but not changing. For me this would be not a good way to bring SE series along. (and it has also a good chance to flop - as my lately posted game examples show)

I also dont find that you can compare an initiative impulse system like you and Barnacle Bill would like to have is similar to a real time system.
In real time the time impulse is infinitely small and thus a user cannot check precisely in which of those microimpulses to act. Therefore a guy which has a certain trained mouse ability is ALWAYS in advantage to another guy which has not this ability. And this is guilty in every game with RT sequences. (included SFB and Harpoon and so on) Some people claim that everybody has "enough" time for clicking/commanding their forces. But this argument is not valid, because its not true. In EVERY real time game the right mouse click at the right time is always better than the the right mouse click at the wrong time. And this puts a heavy disadvantage on untrained mouseclickers. I would like to have the SE series to be games which are a contests of the minds not of the fingers.

bye
Klaus