PPB Rebalance Poll

[kalthalior]

I usually don't get involved in controversial subjects like this, (being somewhat new to the game, and esp. new to the board!) but I guess I will put in my two cents. Has anyone proposed making PPB a 40kt weapon? Doing that (making mounts alot less effective for the size at 60kt/80kt etc.) and upping the research a trifle could make it bring it more into line with the other DF weapon families. I have to agree with whomever said that the entire weapons/damage structure should be looked at in its entirety. I am especially confused about Mesons and APB, what is the point in having two DF weapons so much alike? Maybe Mesons should skip armor (which I think someone proposed awhile back)?

[oleg]

Change size can also work, but 30 to 40 is
almost 33% drop in damage per size.

MB are easier to research and at first they give
more damage than APB. But as time goes APB outgun MB. This part of tech tree is very nicely balanced, IMHO.

[Baron Munchausen]

It's bizarre how someone can say something three times and still someone else will bring it up as a 'new' suggestion in the same thread. Is our computer-driven haste making us that absent minded?

[Andrés]

I agree with Taera, PPB should be a "special" support weapon, and not a main super weapon.
That's why I think that they should not be more difficult to research but have a lower damage ratio, no matter if that's achieved by lowering damage, increasing tonnage or increasing reload time.
Most complains are from people that is too used to use it as their main weapon, and fear that their strategies will crumple once you take away the weapon they depend on.
You have the same problem with AI.
Many of the best AI races use or abuse the advantages of PPB, and if it's changed they will suffer.
Changing the data files locally for a personal mod does not solve the problem, unless you want to edit every AI race, what would be a great mod. Removing the advantage in PPB, although it enhances overall balance, will certainly disrupt the status quo, and AI races will have to be updated accordingly.
That is why we're discussing and trying to reach an agreement.
If we can find a simple solution that most players like, then we can submit it to MM for inclusion, next patch in the official game.

[oleg]

Updating AI would not be that dificult. For example, change to APB will require substitution of "8" to "1" in ship designs, moving down physicsII in research file and substitution of polaron weapons by energy weapons (may require one ot two more entries if you want to optimize how fast to reach level 12). Should not take much time.

[geoschmo]

So here we go. Another perfect example of why "balancing" is never as simple or easy to do as it first appears.

From perusing this thread I can see TWO camps of people. One that feels the PPB is too strong of a weapon, and one that feels it's strength is just fine but that it's too easy to research. Of course there are individuals that agree with both, or neither, but those are the two main sides to the discussion.

And within each group are several possible "fixes". Which is the right answer? Is there a right answer?

Geocshmo

[Master Belisarius]

Originally posted by geoschmo:

And within each group are several possible "fixes". Which is the right answer? Is there a right answer?
Geocshmo

Good question Geo. I leave the answer for God (our God Aaron)!
I don't know the RIGHT answer (all of them are fine with me), but I know the WORST answer: "Keep it like now".
I disliked the way that the Ionic Disperser was fixed. But at least was fixed... I expect the same for the PPB and why not, for the PDC.

[capnq]

I'm in the camp that thinks "fixing" Phased Shields would solve the PPB problem. Unfortunately, that just shifts the debate to a different set of components; I've yet to see a "fix" for Phased shields that I agreed with, either.

[oleg]

I agree with M.B.

It does NOT matter how PPB is fixed, but something should be done.

Raising research cost is best and impliest solution, it will bring PPB in line with APB and phased shields. There will be more variety: one person can still go for PPB ASAP, another will invest in shields. And neither way will put you in disadvantage, like it is now.

[raynor]

Originally posted by God Emperor:
I agree with those who suggest that the problem isnt necessarily PPB's but the fact that there are no better weapons further up the tech tree. WMG's rate of fire is too slow for it to be an automatic replacement for PPB's.

What we need are additional weapons (like in MOO2) such as disruptors, phasors, Gauss Cannons, Neutron BLasters, Stellar Converters, Plasma Bolts, etc.....

Sounds like a few of us need to come up with some additional components!

I agree completely. Once you research the PPB, you might as well stop researching other ship-to-ship weapons. There just isn't anything else down the line that is going to compare.

I would really enjoy seeing someone design a truly long ranged weapon early in the tech tree that doesn't have much punch. Then, create another weapon family in the middle of the tree that ramps up the damage. Then, at the end of the tech tree let the weapon do WMG damage with a 1 ROF.