OT: US President (US Dom Players only)

[lch]

Originally Posted by Bwaha

You see why there's such concern about where our country is going.

Yeah, I'd be concerned about people like that in Congress, too.

Also, as has been mentioned earlier (Godwin's law), this guy just shot himself in the foot by Reductio ad Hitlerum. And so did you.

[JimMorrison]

Originally Posted by Bwaha

Obama's comments about a national security force came during a speech in Colorado about building a new civil service corps. Among other things, he called for expanding the nation's foreign service and doubling the size of the Peace Corps "to renew our diplomacy."

"We cannot continue to rely only on our military in order to achieve the national security objectives that we've set," Obama said in July. "We've got to have a civilian national security force that's just as powerful, just as strong, just as well-funded."

I think this concept of "Civil Service", and the concept of "security" were being lumped together. That is to say that if we had better foreign relations, and a more contented citizenry, that we would safer (read: more secure) from terrorist attacks, whether domestic or foreign in origin.

Originally Posted by Bwaha

Broun said he also believes Obama likely will move to ban gun ownership if he does build a national police force.

Oh how we love biased conjecture. What else does Broun believe? He's a member of the Committee on Homeland Security - so maybe he is just protecting himself, while whipping up anti-liberal sentiment?

Originally Posted by Bwaha

"We can't be lulled into complacency," Broun said. "You have to remember that Adolf Hitler was elected in a democratic Germany. I'm not comparing him to Adolf Hitler. What I'm saying is there is the potential."

You see why there's such concern about where our country is going.

And so the threshold of Godwin's Law is breached.

No, I don't see why there is "such concern", not from this. I saw concern on a nearly daily basis, due to GW Bush's actions, inactions, and legislation. You let someone gut the 4th amendment, and then you run around screaming that someone else might infringe "a little" bit on another amendment, in your eyes?

All I see here is politically aimed propaganda and hysteria-mongering.

Let's all relive 2004 and run around chanting "9/11, terrorism, Bin Laden" for a few months, shall we? I'm sure that will be productive. Let's always measure people by what we can imagine to fear they are capable of, rather than what they are actually doing, or have done. We just got through 8 of the worst years of governance in this nation's history, and McCain looked to want to continue walking down that same path - at least give the alternative a chance to step into office and prove he can do even just a LITTLE BIT better than what we've been trained to accept.

[JimMorrison]

Originally Posted by lch

Yeah, I'd be concerned about people like that in Congress, too.

Also, as has been mentioned earlier (Godwin's law), this guy just shot himself in the foot by Reductio ad Hitlerum. And so did you.

How dare you beat me to the post. I demand a duel, select your fish!

[Bwaha]

I don't think that Obama is hitler, I am very worried about our future. I think that we have to be watchful and informed. I try to get my information from many sources. Sometimes they are right and sometimes wrong. But at least I make an effort to stay informed. The parallels of where we are now is frightening similar to the hyperinflation of the mark. And the response is the same, Print more money. Create a national but separate "police" force. Wiki the Wiermar Republic.
I'm just scared that if we don't watch and restrain the government it will turn against us. Being informed is the one and only way to stop tyrants. I'm sorry if I offended you but I think we have to discuss the potental and guard against it.

[lch]

Originally Posted by Bwaha

I don't think that Obama is hitler, I am very worried about our future. I think that we have to be watchful and informed. I try to get my information from many sources. Sometimes they are right and sometimes wrong. But at least I make an effort to stay informed. The parallels of where we are now is frightening similar to the hyperinflation of the mark. And the response is the same, Print more money. Create a national but separate "police" force. Wiki the Wiermar Republic.

It runs in parallel because there was a stock market crash, too. The things that are done to combat hyperinflation are the same. But what brought down the Weimar Republic was that the chancellor could abuse power too easily and subvert the system by emergency decrees, in times of war for example.

Originally Posted by Bwaha

I'm just scared that if we don't watch and restrain the government it will turn against us. Being informed is the one and only way to stop tyrants. I'm sorry if I offended you but I think we have to discuss the potental and guard against it.

Where have you been seven years ago?

[thejeff]

Read the original speech. Not the wingnut's take on it. He's talking about expanding AmeriCorps, the Peace Corps, programs like that. Not some new secret police force.
There's one line, that Broun quotes, that if you take it out of context and squint just the right way can hint at some security force. In context, he's talking about relying on diplomacy not just the military.

Sure watch the government, be informed, but at the same time don't latch on to the first paranoid conspiracy theory you find.

Aside: If you think Broun's credible, my favorite pet project of his is his personal crusade to make our fighting men and women safer by removing porn from military bases.

[JimMorrison]

Originally Posted by thejeff

Aside: If you think Broun's credible, my favorite pet project of his is his personal crusade to make our fighting men and women safer by removing porn from military bases.

Oh come on. Do you know how many studies have shown that chronic masturbation directly impedes a soldier's crisis response? No..... Well, none really, but you can imagine it if you already dislike porn, and the concept is presented to you!

[Gandalf Parker]

Originally Posted by lch

Yeah, I'd be concerned about people like that in Congress, too.

Also, as has been mentioned earlier (Godwin's law), this guy just shot himself in the foot by Reductio ad Hitlerum. And so did you.

Cute. Godwins Law I knew of course. But thats the first time I remember seeing it put into logic rules as Reducto_ad_Hitlerium.

[Bwaha]

My fears are based on the Patriot Act. When you are charged under it you lose all your rights. They can lock you up and there is no appeal. No council. No Habeas Corpus. Yes I blame bush for this travesty. We need to rid ourselves of this law. It concentrates power and removes our right of redress. Look man, I'm not trying to tick you off, I'm trying to talk about a serous problem. Our civil liberties are being taken away. And as far as Obama is concerned, we should ask him to rid us of this law. We should petition congress as well.

[JimMorrison]

I agree 100%, Bwaha.

I do hope, that if Obama does something about this atrocious blight on American justice, that even the most hard-hearted of conservatives will start to see the possibilities that the future holds.....

Seriously, I have seen nothing that makes me think that Obama himself would abuse the "rights" given to the establishment through the Patriot Act. Would that I had remembered to reference it in the fascism sub-argument earlier.....