The problem of low hit points on humans

[Epaminondas]

Agarajag,

I am not sure what you meant by the following statement:

"If I had to hazard a guess, it would be that Arralen thought that the lack of manual on your side has less to do with you playing the game's demo, and more to do with you obtaining a copy of the game in what we call here* cynically 'my uncle from america'".

Regardless, I have made it clear that the primary reason I don't have a copy of the game is because my old computer has a CD-drive malfunction, and that I have ordered a new computer from Dell to replace it. Further, it makes no sense for me to have the full game when I can't play it until the new computer arrives. In fact, I have even started a thread asking what computer specification is needed to play the game tolerably, and further posted the specification of the computer I have ordered from Dell.

[Zebion]

Why not give some heros, points of experience as their already gained,and boost them by that? Some of those heros have been fighting a long time

[Taqwus]

...in particular, it gives a way of distinguishing those that between veteran heroes who are unusually good mostly because of their experience (and thus who may not have that much room to improve, instead of getting 5 stars worth of additional experience and bonuses) versus those who have more innate potential (ex. the extremely lucky, the assorted spawn of philandering deities, et al).

But ordinary humans... are humans. Doesn't really matter how hardy they are when they've just been disemboweled with a trident or bitten in two by a dragon. High Defense, maybe even innate Air Shield (extreme skill at missile dodging) or if Luck were more granular rather than 50-50 always, perhaps lower encumberance reflecting staying power... most aren't walking around after being almost entirely dipped in the Styx, or bearing arms from the forges of Hephaestos, or walking around with god's blood.

[UninspiredName]

most aren't walking around after being almost entirely dipped in the Styx, or bearing arms from the forges of Hephaestos, or walking around with god's blood.

...And if they were, they'd be Pretenders. :P

At any rate, I suppose a line needs to be drawn between 'mundane' realism and 'suspension of disbelief' realism. In D&D HP is an abstraction, but just looking at the hitpoints of units in this game tells you they're not. The other RPGs people speak of are all centered on your party, so making them so vulnerable is a bad idea. In Dominions, between aging, afflictions, 'commander attack' spells, etc, it's obvious the 'characters' aren't meant to be constants to any extent.

...That's not to understate the effectiveness of an ordinary general on the frontlines with an attack-boosting item and a Wave Breaker. Just not alone. Also bring a backup general.

[Graeme Dice]

UninspiredName said:
...That's not to understate the effectiveness of an ordinary general on the frontlines with an attack-boosting item and a Wave Breaker. Just not alone.

It's effectiveness is decent until you run into a holy three priest who kills him in an average of two turns (For a commander with MR 10).

[CaptainGimpy]

Well it wouldn't be so bad for heroes like Conan the Barbarian who fit into dominions' setting to have some sort of ability to get into scraps and survive. Either through really high attack and defense skills or some sort of heroic ability that lets them get a stat boost when they're in a tough spot.

[Agrajag]

Epaminondas said:
Agarajag,

I am not sure what you meant by the following statement:

"If I had to hazard a guess, it would be that Arralen thought that the lack of manual on your side has less to do with you playing the game's demo, and more to do with you obtaining a copy of the game in what we call here* cynically 'my uncle from america'".

'my uncle from america' is an expression, describing something obtained from dubious sources, specifically, pirated games.
Furthermore, check out the Lich pretender, he has 30 HP, and that's because his body is "leathery and dry and lacks all organs of importance"
The ***** Queen has 25 hp, and she is a giant werewolf.
A Pheonix has 15 hp.
And I'd say its pretty obvious that there are more pretenders with even less HP, which are less worthy of mention.

So a boost to 20 HP is not minor thematically, and besides increasing a unit from 13 hp to 20 hp is a ~54% boost! (which would make them more than ~54% more valuable and useful)

[Hullu]

I find it weird that people find this a problem.

If 10hp is the 'average human', I then personally know people in real life who have less than 5hp, and people who have way over 20hp.

Why don't our FANTASY heroes have the variety that is present even in our normal everyday life?

If someone failed to understand, I don't see any realistic, thematic, moral or balance reason why human heroes should have 15hp or so maximum. I just fail to see _ANY_ reason why they have to be so brittle.

[Endoperez]

I wouldn't say boost to 20 hp is thematically major, but it IS huge when compared to other units.

I don't think low hp are a problem. It makes some people's preferred tactics hard to pull off. There are many theoretical ways we can fix this, some of which might get more uniform support. We can't mod these things yet, and perhaps never will be able to, but here we go:

- Every star of experience gives an extra hitpoint. Some would opt for more than 1 hp, e.g. 1,1,2,1,2 hp. A 3-star human would have 3-5 extra hp (depending on suggestion), so 16 to 18 (if they started from 13, common for melee commanders).

- Lycanthropos' Amulet boosts the base unit instead of transforming the unittype. +1 att, +4 str, +10hp, "Bite" attack, regen, a downside or two. Again, details change between people.

I'm not sure why I even wrote this post, btw. It doesn't really add anything.

[Saarud]

While I like how the game currently treats human commanders I also understand that some people want more human heroes, heck I would like that myself. Isn't it possible to keep the commanders as they are and create a new unit for human nations that is called Hero. This unit could be abit better at certain things including HP. The best thing would be if it could be randomized (kinda like mages with magic) on certain skills. They should be quite abit more expensive though as heroes do demand more treasures than regular people.Also they should have zero commanding ability and leave that to the regular commanders.

Can anyone with the skills make a hero mod like that?