Ashdod is worthless now

[Corinthian]

Na. Other blesses like W9N4 would usually be even cheaper. Good E/N blessers are rare. F or W? Not so much.

The real reason that E9N4 is popular is that it can be used for more than just your troops. Forge a shroud and put it on a Cyclops or something and have it go wild! And that is only if you dont have national self-blessing thugs. Because no other bless is as good for thugging.

[kianduatha]

Could you give some examples please? (Other than Ahiman Anakites, that is)

[triqui]

Originally Posted by kianduatha

Could you give some examples please? (Other than Ahiman Anakites, that is)

Sanguine Douses being unique artifacts, for example.

I don't see how size of the game change availability of blesses. You wouldn't play F9W9 Ashdod in any game. Power of different blesses in different metagames will be different. But game size wouldn't promote "unplayable" bless to "playable" it could only change the best one from "playable"

W9F9B8 would be absolutelly atrocious bless for any nation in a game with 25 provinces per nation and 20 nations, becouse the cost in scales would make it incredibly hurtful in the long run, plus you probably won't be able to take enough adventage from your sacreds to make it worthy.
In a 1vs1 match in a 20 provinces map, that bless alone might give you the victory before a proper counter is developed.

Otoh, a bless like S9 gets extra power once Wish is developed (it gives you a wisher, your pretender), and having +3 MR in your thugs and commanders is much more relevant in turn 60 than it is in turn 20.

So yes, I think the size of the map is very important to decide bless viability, becouse size of the game / map directly influence the length of the game, and the things that are useful in turn 15 aren't the same that are useful in turn 90. Blitz matches tend to gravitic toward fast and furious blesses, making some options unviable in that specific kind of match. That does not mean the option is not viable in some other kinds of matches.

[Scaramuccia]

I don't see how size of the game change availability of blesses. You wouldn't play F9W9 Ashdod in any game. Power of different blesses in different metagames will be different. But game size wouldn't promote "unplayable" bless to "playable" it could only change the best one from "playable".

There are two exceptions - additional mods(ofc) and games with small number of opponents(size doesn't matter it could be duel on 100 province map).

[Corinthian]

Oh Squirrel. You are truly the master of not reading the post you are replying to. The individual giant is weaker, the Giants are stronger! More of them gives you more damage output and because the N6 bless will protect against afflictions, (unlike the N4), the giants will also suffer less attrition.

And why would anyone ever want a green dragon for this bless? It is much more expensive! Not only is it 25p more expensive, it also starts with dom 1! I told you we need strong dominion! Niefel giants get +/- 2 points of protection and +/- 1 point of attack, defense and strength per point of cold/heat in the province. Even Niefel jarls with E9N4 blessings can die to normal indies in heat 1 dominion.

And I guess the Wolf can expand on his own if taken awake. (Why?!?!) He got fear +5 and awe from his dominion. He also have 122hp.

His water bless is a small but nice bonus. But it does add up. The real protection comes from the numbers though. More giants mean more cold auras that can stack witch means less turns the enemies remain conscious. Having more giants mean that they wont be ganged up on as much so the little water bless last longer.

I have always found the skinshifters to be rather mediocre personally. They cost to much to be massable and they simply dont have the damage output or survivability to be truly powerful. Maybe if they had two claw attacks like the normal skinshifter.

And although Jarl expansion is a neat concept, it is more economical to just send out 2-3 normal giants + a priest.

[Squirrelloid]

Originally Posted by Corinthian

Oh Squirrel. You are truly the master of not reading the post you are replying to. The individual giant is weaker, the Giants are stronger! More of them gives you more damage output and because the N6 bless will protect against afflictions, (unlike the N4), the giants will also suffer less attrition.

I am so done with this thread, since its not even worth debating stupid things like Fenrir being a good expanding chassis (Have you even tried it? I have, it blows), or W4N6 being a good use of your pretender for Nieflheim.

But patently false things like an N4 bless not reducing affliction chance? The heck? Corinthian, you should know better than that. Regeneration - any regeneration - reduces affliction chance by the exact same amount, which is where the N-bless affliction reduction comes from.

My only answer to the recent round of stupid is - try playing that in a real game, see how it works out for you. Heck, try W4N6 Niefl Jarls as expanding SCs. I'm pretty sure that fails horribly. But its thanksgiving, and I'm not inclined to check right now. Unblessed Niefl Jarls do die to quite a bit though, so i can't imagine that bless is going to help all that much (encumbrance kills).