Drone and Anti-Drone Tactics? - Page 7

Mephisto · #61 February 6th, 2002, 01:29 AM

One short example against the more versatile drones: If you could command drones to move around you could also easily use them for defense. In a system with 10 planets you can build an average of 6 to 7 drones per turn. Each of this drones will Last at least 5 rounds. You don�t need any spaceyards to build those. You don�t have to pay maintenance. But you could easily park them on a warp point and build a very very powerful defense with about 25 to 30 drones on defense at all times. As it seems MM found this to unbalancing so he decided against it. But if you think it should be altered mail Aaron about it. As we all know, MM is listening to the community very carefully.

Phoenix-D · #62 February 6th, 2002, 02:25 AM

If you want to play the definitions game, try this one:

If something is done intentionally, it is NOT A BUG. It's a design decision. This is where the flame part of your statement came in- accusing MM of releasing a game with a known bug when in fact you've named nothing of the sort.

There's much in SE4 that doesn't agree with current military terms.

EDIT: here's a few
Battleship: a warship of the largest and most heavily armed and armored class. In SE4? A ship of 800kt. Dreadnaughts and baseships are bigger.

"Shields" in current terms are nothing like SE4 shields. Neither are ion engines. "Capital Ship Missles" can be mounted on pretty much anything other than a fighter.

Phoenix-D

[ 06 February 2002: Message edited by: Phoenix-D ]

jimbob · #63 February 6th, 2002, 02:49 AM

Err.. yeah, so a little tension here...

Well, I can definitely see Jourin's point about looking forward to getting one thing and definitely not getting it. Unfortunately definitions and thus expectations are just too flexible, especially when MM is in the business of creating a pretend, futuristic Universe.

Personally, I'd love to see (1) the Drones get cheaper, which is easily enough to mod (see below) and (2) some drones being capable of scouting through warp points, which is not modable.

My suggestion: ask MM to make a special component that allows Drones to go through warp points (how about a "warp motivator"). Make it either prohibitively expensive or (my favorite) just make it big... like half the size of the Drone. Thus people will be able to create warpable drones, but these will still be inferior to small ships because you end up with less space for additional components.

Just my thoughts on it all. Hope y'all have a good day.

-jimbob

PvK · #64 February 6th, 2002, 02:52 AM

This example of 30 drones on a warp point doesn't sound at all unbalancing to me, if someone is spending the output of ten planets to build it. It's going to be effective against some attackers, but quite expensive to maintain. I don't think it'd be more effective than alternative defenses using the same or fewer resources. The drones I've encountered (even in swarms of 30 or so) have not been all that hard to shoot down, and they expire pretty quickly, can't gain experience or be resupplied or carry cargo.

It's also probably a lot less efficient than building cargo/launcher bases at the warp point and filling them with drones that can wait for something to attack, and won't expire. This can be done without a move order for drones.

PvK

quote:
Originally posted by [K126]Mephisto:
One short example against the more versatile drones: If you could command drones to move around you could also easily use them for defense. In a system with 10 planets you can build an average of 6 to 7 drones per turn. Each of this drones will Last at least 5 rounds. You don’t need any spaceyards to build those. You don’t have to pay maintenance. But you could easily park them on a warp point and build a very very powerful defense with about 25 to 30 drones on defense at all times. As it seems MM found this to unbalancing so he decided against it. But if you think it should be altered mail Aaron about it. As we all know, MM is listening to the community very carefully.

PvK · #65 February 6th, 2002, 02:57 AM

Except that drones can already move through warp points - if their target is on the other side of one. There's just no way to give them orders to do so without a target, which IMO should be changed.

PvK

quote:
Originally posted by jimbob:
...
Personally, I'd love to see (1) the Drones get cheaper, which is easily enough to mod (see below) and (2) some drones being capable of scouting through warp points, which is not modable.

My suggestion: ask MM to make a special component that allows Drones to go through warp points (how about a "warp motivator"). Make it either prohibitively expensive or (my favorite) just make it big... like half the size of the Drone. Thus people will be able to create warpable drones, but these will still be inferior to small ships because you end up with less space for additional components.
...

Baron Munchausen · #66 February 6th, 2002, 03:10 AM

There seems to be a misconception sneaking into the discussion here. Drones definitely CAN go through warp points. What they cannot do is move anywhere without a designated target to attack. So, even if you've seen an enemy system you cannot launch attacks without 'live' recon data. I find this a problem, as do others. I hope 'move to' and 'explore' will be added to drones soon in a patch. I don't see a reason to restrict this ability with any extra expenses/component, either. These are both very simple missions that a drone computer should be able to comprehend.

On the other hand, I don't see drones as useful 'sentinel' weapons like satellites. They have a fixed supply usage per turn and cannot be recovered. So, once launched they are counting down to destruction one way or another. You can set that supply usage very low, of course. I do wish he would change it to 'minimum per turn' rather than a fixed level no matter what, so that if you burned more than that minimum during movement it would not subtract that much more on top. It affects drone range considerably as it is.

[ 06 February 2002: Message edited by: Baron Munchausen ]

Magnum357 · #67 February 6th, 2002, 09:42 AM

I'm sorry, but I disagree. How do you know that navigating to a Warp point is an "Easy" thing? It could be quite difficult. Also, maybe special equipment is needed to make the jump through a Warp Point which could not be possible in a Drone (too small for example). Personally, I like the way Drones are right now. It keeps them very limited in what you can do with them and you have to really think in order to use them effectively.

Q · #68 February 6th, 2002, 12:31 PM

I think this is a classic example where you could make everyone happy by making a line in the settings text file:

drones can be give move to/warp orders: true/false

Please!

Mephisto · #69 February 6th, 2002, 12:53 PM

I guess Q is right. :-)

geoschmo · #70 February 6th, 2002, 05:20 PM

Let's keep this thread on track.

If you have a complaint about how drones function currently, make it. If you have a suggestion about how to make them "better", let us hear it.

No more arguments about definitions or semantics of whether it's "bug" or a "feature". No more arguments about whether or not it was promised and not delivered.

Keep your head, maintain your cool, say your piece.

Geoschmo