This game is an expensive coaster - Page 9

mottlee · #81 May 26th, 2001, 05:06 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Kagetora:
I am not Bill B. I am assuming you think I am because we share an email address purely as a junk mail dump. However, so far the only thing you did to me personally other than not complete this game I paid for, is give out my real name on another board. I think that was foolish, misplaced and wrong but it is unlikely to cause me any suffering. I also would point out I have never shouted or called anybody a name least of all you. However, you enraged my friend and he has actually obtained an attorney. Not sure where that might lead yet. However, are you offering me this game? Are you offering it to him? Both of us? Not sure he would want you to know what his actual name is which you would if he responded to this. I will have to ask him.

[This message has been edited by Kagetora (edited 26 May 2001).]

[This message has been edited by Kagetora (edited 26 May 2001).]

IF you share an E-mail address YOU must take take some of the falt in this also for there is no way to tell just WHO is sending E-mails IF you share one (also you can get into a lot of hot water)(and lots of stink too)

------------------
mottlee@gte.net
"Kill em all let God sort em out"

Kagetora · #82 May 26th, 2001, 05:18 PM

IF you share an E-mail address YOU must take take some of the falt in this also for there is no way to tell just WHO is sending E-mails IF you share one (also you can get into a lot of hot water)(and lots of stink too<<<<<

No you misunderstand. I don't actually use that address to send any email, neither does he. We just put that address in when asked for on Boards and such because a lot of places Online take that address and put you on the junk email list of the earth. I never even log on that address nor do I read any of the mail that goes there. It never crossed my mind somebody like Richard might do what he did and misunderstand. He shouldn't have done it in the first place.

LeTharg · #83 May 26th, 2001, 05:43 PM

Kagetora,
I've been thinking about your claim. If I was on a jury I would find against you. You can't use weak AI as a claim that you were ripped off since you had played the demo before purchasing and knew the state of the AI.

So your entire claim rests on the "promise" of TCP/IP. But you have presented no evidence in this thread that there was a promise of TCP/IP especially a promise with a definate date. I wasn't here then so I don't know but the other posters make it clear that there was no committment to TCP/IP. Instead there was a list of possible enhancements. User preferance for other enhancements has put TCP/IP way down the list.

I would find you guilty of being a foolish consumer however. If TCP/IP was so important to you, you should have waited to purchase until that was truly available. You seem to have familiarity with the software and game marketplace so your claim of taking a to-do list for a commitment seems disingenuous to me.

Resident Alien · #84 May 26th, 2001, 05:58 PM

quote:

Originally posted by Kagetora:
I am not Bill B. I am assuming you think I am because we share an email address purely as a junk mail dump. However, so far the only thing you did to me personally other than not complete this game I paid for, is give out my real name on another board. I think that was foolish, misplaced and wrong but it is unlikely to cause me any suffering. I also would point out I have never shouted or called anybody a name least of all you. However, you enraged my friend and he has actually obtained an attorney. Not sure where that might lead yet. However, are you offering me this game? Are you offering it to him? Both of us? Not sure he would want you to know what his actual name is which you would if he responded to this. I will have to ask him.

Originally posted by mottlee:
IF you share an E-mail address YOU must take take some of the falt in this also for there is no way to tell just WHO is sending E-mails IF you share one (also you can get into a lot of hot water)(and lots of stink too)

I would like to initiate a debate upon the Duality of the Kagetora/BillB entity.

Up to now the followers of the debate have on balance believed that there were two entities involved - mostly based on the forthright claims of K.

The two are:
1) BillB - a wildly inconsitent entity - swinging from saying what a great game this is, to suddenly "this sucks, I want my TCP/IP, I'm calling my lawyer". I postulate that this entity be labelled the "Dark Side" of the K/BB Duality.

2) Kagetora- consistantly demanding his perceived rights regardless of reasonableness and scale of $'s expended. Has maintained a consistant argument in face of many unbelievers. And fervently claims to not be BillB (and who in their right mind would want to be associated with BB's posting record?).

What is the evidence:

a) They share an e-mail account. For junk only K says.
b) Their opinions are very similar.
c) They do not post on the same web Boards at the same time.
d) However the tone of posting is subtely different.

After review of the circumstantial evidence this author will continue to believe in the separate nature of these two entities until decisive evidence is brought forward to prove they are one and the same.

However the many followers of the K/BB Duality theory will not be convinced.

[This message has been edited by Resident Alien (edited 26 May 2001).]

[This message has been edited by Resident Alien (edited 26 May 2001).]

Kagetora · #85 May 26th, 2001, 06:09 PM

I've been thinking about your claim. If I was on a jury I would find against you. You can't use weak AI as a claim that you were ripped off since you had played the demo before purchasing and knew the state of the AI.<<<<

Well what you say is true. However, you are blaming me for being gullible and getting conned and letting the person who conned me off the hook. I had no reason to believe they wouldn't do as they said they would. In retrospect I certainly should have waited until the TCP/IP feature was actually in. But, I had no reason to think it would take so long either. I figured I could take the time to learn the game and be prepared for real opponents when it did get put in. The design of the game is pretty complex.

Kagetora · #86 May 26th, 2001, 06:20 PM

a) They share an e-mail account. For junk only K says.
b) Their opinions are very similar.
c) They do not post on the same web Boards at the same time.
d) However the tone of posting is subtely different.<<<<

Well I hate being forced to defend myself when I haven't even done anything. However, as to the email that can be proved quite easily. The address is puzzlesthewill@aol.com bomb away to your hearts content. Would I do that if I actually used that address?

We are friends, we have discussed this issue at length and we both got fed up about it at the same time. Thus why we have similar opinions. He has never posted on this board and I have never posted on that one. I haven't even posted on this one myself before the Last few days since probably December sometime. As I said before I just check in periodically to get the new patches and find out if the TCP/IP is done yet.

The tone is subjective and you will have to judge for yourself. I am not saying anything further to "prove" I am myself. This should never have even been a topic of conversation and wouldn't be if Richard had not violated my privacy without cause.

Dracus · #87 May 26th, 2001, 06:34 PM

You go to a software store (i.e. Best buy) and buy a computer game. Take It home but find you are not happy with that game. So you try to get best buy to give you your money back. SInce the game is opened they will not give you a refund nor will they let you get another game in it's place. They will exchange it for another copy only if it is damaged upon opening. (Shrapnel has also done this)
Best buy has no way of knowing if you just copied the game and are trying to steal it by getting your money back. So they have a policy in place that says no refunds on opened software. The fact that Shrapnel is willing to replace your game with some other author's game is in my mind beyond and above anything you would get from a retailer or even most big named software developers.

As for being a minion or not very bright (I think that is what You said in an earlier post) I consider That I am very Intelligent as I work in the computer field and have been playing computer games since they were written in basic and had no display. just words on the the screen. Nor am I a minion of any game company. I play real time games and I play turn based games. When I want to play without planing and time to think about my next action, I play real time games like Myth. When I want to sit back and role play or think about my next action, turn based games are the way to go. So as a turned based game, SEIV is a very good game. (I could send you a box full of games that suck and were put out by big companies with a lot of statements for things they were going to add posted right on the shipping box that they never did.) Unless you are like me and just like to try new games just to see what they are, then you should never buy one just because you think they will add something in the future. You sould buy it because you like the demo/sharware/prior vers. So if you are looking for Web play games, then you should stick to buying thoses that release with it included. Unless they stated that they for sure will have something by such and such date and then don't provide it, there really is no legal case. (I have not seen anyplace were this was stated that Web play would be added with any actual insurance.)
If there is
then post the site locations and I will be glad to review them. This is the best action to take rather then post that we are lacking in brain area or a false statement that your dog can beat the game.(A MORE BELIEVEABLE STATEMENT WOULD HAVE BEEN: My 3yr old can beat this game.) which results in others judging you as either being a child in which case you would have no understanding of the legal system (if this is the case then I for one excuse you and withdraw any and all my Posts in this matter.) or that you are an adult with a child like mentality in which case, I really don't know what to say.

As for being the same person, I have never been to the other site so I can not make any statement for this nor do I plan on trying to. I am just sticking with what you have personally wrote.

[This message has been edited by Dracus (edited 26 May 2001).]

Kagetora · #88 May 26th, 2001, 06:41 PM

. If you order a computer game and get a computer game.... The comparison doesn't fly.

You bought the game based on the fact that it might get TCP/IP sometime in the future, it hasn't yet but it might one day so you are SOL for the moment. You can be patient and wait, or forget the whole thing, sell the game on e-bay, take Shrapnel offered game, if you push it enough maybe get your money back etc. Not un-reasonable options.

How many hours have you played SE4? I don't believe you didn't enjoy playing at least one game vs the AI at the start. If you didn't care, you wouldn't be posting. I guess you received some value for that original $40 - $10 or $20 at least.

Personally I could spend $40 on sushi and beer in an hour. <<<<

Well, I would argue that a disk that has a game on it that I can't participate in, in any manner that I wished to when I bought it or that any other game company would even consider appropriate, I didn't get a computer game I got a coaster for my 45 bucks.

I am not sure Richard was offering the game to me. If he says he was that would satisfy me. He hasn't responded yet. Look you are obviously young so lacking in experience about such things. But, if you watch the ads for all that crap on TV late at night I can assure you 90 percent of that stuff doesn't work at all the way they say it does. They even give a money back guarantee which this company didn't even do. They make their money because they know 99.9 percent of the people who get it and find out it doesn't work aren't going to bother to rebox it and send it back. Nor are any of them going to sue for a lousy 20 bucks. However, that does not make selling a faulty product suddenly ethical. It only takes one person to get mad enough to do something about it.

No I think the kitchen analogy was quite apt. I would even stretch it further. If I am promised the kitchen by the contractor and he leaves off the hardware he could do as this company is and say. "Well I never promised you hardware for the cabinets" A judge would rule that an assumption that a finished kitchen would have hardware was implied in the contract whether or not they actually said it or not. Regardless of what was actually specifically promised for this game is irrelevant actually. The point is, is this game a finished computer game? Did the company do the finishing? I would say no.

Suicide Junkie · #89 May 26th, 2001, 06:42 PM

quote:
Look I understand okay? You all are arguing with BS logic. If I order a gun from a company and they send me a hammer instead. You can't tell me I shouldn't be pissed because I can still defend myself with a hammer. It's not the same thing.

They gave you the damn gun, now go get the bullets and play-by-web with your friends.

That is what you want, right? To play humans? Then go ahead. Nobody's stopping you, and certainly not SE4.EXE.

Kagetora · #90 May 26th, 2001, 06:51 PM

Also if you would like to check out http://seiv.pbw.cc I would be happy to oblige you with a game against real live humans. It's not as fast as TCP/IP I guess, but I have a game there that is up to turn 45 in three weeks. At this rate we should be well past 100 turns in 6 months.<<<<

I have certainly done marathons before. The main problem I see with this is you have to have reliable people that keep the turns moving. My biggest concern is I would spend months and as soon as I start beating somebody they would quit. With TCP/IP my friends and I could play an entire game in a weekend or 2 weekends at most. It's just too much time and effort for me any other way. Although, I am happy some of you enjoy it.