Russian Long camp: starting force?

[Greyfell]

Topic says it all really. Going to try out a 40 game russian campaign. My german one went to game 20 or so until a russian light armor swarm made me quit in disgust

pretty big core, my initial thoughts were:

company of T-28 (1938) heavy tanks

company of t-26 (1939) medium tanks

three rifle+ companies, with 107mm mortar and 12.7 HMG

one forward observer team

offmap 122mm type 31 battery

battery of 107mm mortars

Motorcycle + company (the one with seperate troops and motorcycle 'mounts' backed up by T-26 tanks, 107mm mortars, and 76.2 type 36 guns, all truck or motorcycle mounted).

two SP-aa platoons, Gaz-aamg trucks

one company of Ba-10 armored cars

This still leaves me with 505 points. Thoughts?

[Imp]

This is one hard campaign at the start, your tanks wont hit much or have many shots & infantry are no better. Training as in experience is nearly none existent seem to remember morale is horrific to. You need to look after them very carefully or you could easily have your entire army pick up its shirt tails & run, horrible arty call times to if remember.
Only good thing first opponent Poles are not much better but the Finns & Germans they are a whole other ball game.
Dont under any circumstances get into drawn out firefights you need to finnish them fast before your troops decide to leg it.
Beware the Finnish AT rifle to its actually dangerous

[gila]

40 battles?

Wow,that's long,might finish it by 2012

[Greyfell]

yeah it is a bit long. I might shorten it up a lot and see what happens.

The poles.... what can I say? The polish scenarios for germany and russia give me nightmares sometimes. So **many** bodies rushing forward.

Yes, artillery call times are horrendous. So much in fact that in the beginning of the game, I pre-set the only crossroad on the polish side of the map as my one pre-fire point and pretty much freight trained that and the one bridge on their side just before the northernmost victory cluster, just to try and do some interdiction. Thankfully the have lots of nice slow blocks of infantry that I can tie down in firefights, providing a mostly immobile target.

[gila]

Good luck!

[codman]

Originally Posted by Greyfell

Topic says it all really. Going to try out a 40 game russian campaign. My german one went to game 20 or so until a russian light armor swarm made me quit in disgust

pretty big core, my initial thoughts were:

company of T-28 (1938) heavy tanks

company of t-26 (1939) medium tanks

three rifle+ companies, with 107mm mortar and 12.7 HMG

one forward observer team

offmap 122mm type 31 battery

battery of 107mm mortars

Motorcycle + company (the one with seperate troops and motorcycle 'mounts' backed up by T-26 tanks, 107mm mortars, and 76.2 type 36 guns, all truck or motorcycle mounted).

two SP-aa platoons, Gaz-aamg trucks

one company of Ba-10 armored cars

This still leaves me with 505 points. Thoughts?

Having trudged through half of a long Russian campaign, I'd suggest that you might want to consider reducing your SPAA platoons to SPAA sections and adding two 37mm AA platoons. Once they gain experience the 37 are rather good at knocking down aircraft and at closer ranges they can knock out half tracks and light tanks. Once you get lend lease HT's you can bring them forward quickly to cover your troops. The reason I suggest going with the smaller sections was that it was easier to rally them when there was only two and that made up for the lost fire power of having five. I also upgraded them to 37mm as I like to feed them routing troops from a distance to get their experience up. The only negative I really see in any of the long campaigns is that (speaking for only myself) it's easy to get attached to your veterans as their experience can really make all the difference as those extra shots count when the AI mobs you.

Have fun and good luck!

Steve

[Mobhack]

In an early Russian core, I tend to prefer taking the 107mm field guns as off-map rather than 122mm.

- slightly more range (useful for counter battery or not being counter-battered)
- small enough warhead not to cause cratering (giving the enemy shell scrapes to hide in) but almost as much effect as 122mm

early on, get some towed 47mm or 45mm ATG, and build up the experience (use as infantry support with HE as well). When the 57mm ATG arrives in 6/41, upgrade. The 57mm is a very useful plinker of early model panzers, until tigers and panthers arrive. (The 76mm ATG is better at longer ranges, but bigger and the crew cannot push them about). Use the half-track truck - it is better over rough ground.

I also like the maxim MMG in rifle companies - the water-cooled WW1 types have a longer range (30?) than the air cooled later ones (24?). Cheaper than the 12.7s, anyway.

The 50mm mortars you get in the early years as indirect units are, quite simply, utterly pants - 800m range is useless. Replace with another mortar type, or HMG section or even a 12.7 AAMG. (The direct fire heavy infantry with a 50mm can be useful for minor anti-tank on class 1 armour, and at least keep them stunned and so less happy).

I also like to have a platoon or 2 of singleton 12.7mm AAMG - shoot at planes, and also used for overhead fire support if placed behind your advance e.g. up on an overlooking ridge. AI may decide they are worthwhile targets and expend some time shelling them too - all to the good, if he is not hitting prime targets (your grunts).

When the 14.5mm ATR come available, I will sometimes change a scout for one. The minor AT capacity is bought at a suicide mission if you actually fire. But sometimes a scout section of scout(cmd) + scout + sniper (changed) and ATR (changed) is useful on the flanks. The ATR can do in an isolated half-track the others have suppressed (to void any irritating return fires), from a few hundred yards off. But I don't "go large" on ATR in core forces.

I try to limit myself to just a section or platoon of T34 or KV total till after 1941 (when the AI starts to go larger on the long 75s). I rely on T-28(e when available) and the T-50 before then (an experienced T-50 can duel with a P3 if it really has to, T-26 is merely a tinfoil target). Sometimes, I will use valentine lend-lease tanks in the period before Moscow instead of T-50. If you simply go large on T-34 or KV on 41, then you romper-stomper the poor AI till the long 75mm arrive, which makes for a boring game. Like playing M1A1 vs T-55 in modern. The AI can deal with the T28e and T-50 and valentine, so you then have to think a bit.

BT are very vulnerable - but I love the sheer speed, so I consider it useful to have a coy of these (loaded with scouts or later desant teams) to zip round flanks, if there is enough cover - in the wide open steppes, they are meat for enemy AAA or ATG gunners. The 2 support ones with 76mm shorts you get in the coy HQ are useful for grunt bashing, or beating up enemy arty once you get into his rear. In fact I rather prefer the support model BT - so may try a campaign where I upgrade 1 out of 3 in the line BT platoons to that model, even 2 of 3. Especially for Poland and Finland - the HE value is probably more relevant there than the 45mm ATG.

So - In your core above, I would have taken BT fast tanks instead of the armoured car coy. The armoured cars of the USSR are not very good IMHO - low ammo loads, moderate speed, tin-plate armour. Maybe BT backed up with some M/C teams (have not tried that one out - they might actually be a useful auxiliary to them).

Cheers
Andy