AI concept of the '80ies ... why?

[Hullu]

You have to struggle hard to make it seem computer produces random numbers, for example.

No matter how much you struggly, computer does not generate random numbers (except perhaps with an outside source of randomness, which also most likely is just pseudorandomness

Yea, offtopic, I know, just had to say it!

[Gandalf Parker]

I would love scriptable computer opponents but the handles needed for that have to be written in from the beginning.

And yes, as its been stated, "human" computer players are hard. Artificial Intelligence (AI) is actually easy, but artificially human (AH) is much harder. Its a common subject in the AI newsgroups.

An AI would figure a path from A to B as the strightest and easiest route. AI is simple and gets done often in programming. But always taking the straight line in a game would quickly be abused by human players. To be more human would have to include concepts like flanking, sneaking around behind him, multiple fronts, etc etc.

The closer to AH that programming gets, the more obvious it is that the easy route is just to add more randoms. Now it becomes deciding whether you can get closer to the goal by starting with AI and adding some randoms, or starting with totally random actions and weeding out the most extreme ones.

I do agree that this game could make good use of "thinking" time. As a hosted game it wouldnt bother me if it took hours to think out its moves. As a solo play it might be able to use spare CPU cycles while Im doing my turn but games that do that tend to become games that take over your machine. I dont think Id like that. I like Dom because it lets me keep all my work windows open and skip back-and-forth

[Endoperez]

I was surprised, yesterday, to see AI using Terminus the mercenarey assassin to conquer my weakky-defended provinces. The first one had PD of just 1 or 2, and he killed the Markata and the Bandar Commander pretty easily. In the next battle, one of the markata happened to score 7 damage to him in the very beginning, and he died. Still, I didn't think AI would consider attacking with a lone commander.

It's still far from being able to build thugs or combatants, but not quite as far as I had thought.

[Recruit]

Endoperez said:
I was surprised, yesterday, to see AI using Terminus the mercenarey assassin to conquer my weakky-defended provinces.

I had that 2A wind mage mercenary conquer 3 of my provinces while i wasn't paying attention. The little bastard took out 10 guys at a time with lightning bolts and air elementals.

[NTJedi]

Gandalf Parker said:
I would love scriptable computer opponents but the handles needed for that have to be written in from the beginning.

Yes scriptable computer opponents would be a great improvement. And with random multiple personalities gamers could examine these personalities as a starting guideline to creating their own AI personality or attempts at improving an existing AI.

[HoneyBadger]

I think you did, Uh-Nu-Buh. I acknowledge it. Sorry, I try to read the posts that have been submitted in a thread before I post, myself, but I skim through and I must have missed it.

Ok, Uh-Nu-Buh has a very good idea!
I second it.

There. Squish.

[Chacal]

Hullu said:

No matter how much you struggly, computer does not generate random numbers (except perhaps with an outside source of randomness, which also most likely is just pseudorandomness

Yea, offtopic, I know, just had to say it!

Radioactive source seem to be a good source of true random
==> http://www.random.org/

Anyway, have anybody here ever seen a good AI in a game (others than chess) ? Personnaly, I see none. Scripts are limited and once understood easly cracked. A true good AI is probably far beyond the focus of a game.

[zepath]

Well...

I, for one, do not want to see any AIs more sophisticated than the one that we have in Dom 3. If they get too smart they'll start posing a serious challenge even on lower settings and they inevitably try to take over the world. Furthermore, I don't really want John Conner to end up as the leader of the human race. He was a punk *** kid. So just say, "No!" to better AIs. And keep them the hell away from our thermonuclear devices, please!

[PhilD]

chacal_ said:
Radioactive source seem to be a good source of true random
==> http://www.random.org/

Yeah, and electronic noise should be another good one, potentially with higher rates. If only we could get some electronics into computers...

I did some quick searches on the subject (as a side line to some "randomized algorithms" lectures I give), and I seem to remember reading that CPU makers (Intel et al.) typically have the means of including pretty good, unpredictable, irreproduceable random number generators in their chips, only it doesn't look like the demand is really there (since space on chips has to come at the expense of some other functions, the integrated RNG has to compete with other, chromier stuff that will make them sell a few more units.