Luck/Turmoil versus Nothing.

[Wrana]

While agreeing with chrispedersen in many respects,

Originally Posted by chrispedersen

If you build nothing but Fortuneteller (5) units in your capital, you will have %badevent = -100 by the time turn 10 winds around. (Which to my mind is when a lot of bad events get enabled).

- is clearly wrong. Each Fortuneteller has his/her own, independent chance to prevent bad events. So, even 10 (or 100) Fortunetellers won't prevent all bad events. But they'll prevent enough to make difference. Also, this reasoning works equally in case of Misfortune. Actually, I think that Luck vs. Order choice (when you don't have points for both, of course!) more depends on whether your nation is more gold- or gem-dependent. And this, in turn, on presence of good non-sacred units and on fortress types. Some also argue for Turmoil/Luck when you would bloodhunt extensively.

[Calahan]

Originally Posted by Wrana

- is clearly wrong. Each Fortuneteller has his/her own, independent chance to prevent bad events. So, even 10 (or 100) Fortunetellers won't prevent all bad events. But they'll prevent enough to make difference.

@ Wrana - Please do not post absolutes about the game mechanics based on your own beliefs or theories without first testing to back them up. Since it is you who is clearly wrong on this occasion, and Chris Pedersen is correct (although his maths skills are a bit worrrying )

The fortune teller ability has already been proven to stack, and a total of 100 does indeed prevent all bad events from happening (as the attached save file, which I posted ~2 years ago shows).

Posting false information about how specific game mechanics work (without first testing) only serves to confuse new players (and seasoned players for that matter)

[chrispedersen]

Nice to see you posting again Cal. You wanna test item bonuses on global dispels btw?

As for math ability.. accurate within the handwave precision I was talking about... Some events activate on turn 7, others earlier and later. 10% here or there is a quibble.

[Wrana]

Originally Posted by Calahan

The fortune teller ability has already been proven to stack, and a total of 100 does indeed prevent all bad events from happening (as the attached save file, which I posted ~2 years ago shows).

Posting false information about how specific game mechanics work (without first testing) only serves to confuse new players (and seasoned players for that matter)

It seems from today's independent test that you were right. Thank you for pointing out. I'm sorry but it was said to me by someone among old-timer players, so I assumed that it was true.
By the way, the same test also shown that total Fortuneteller 100 seems to prevent all bad events regardless of Misfortune. (Turm 3, Misf 3 - and only good events for 10-15 turns in several provinces).
Of course, my thesis about Fortuneteller being useful with both Luck and Misfortune still stands.
And, by the way, one current game where I have Misfortune 2 gave me 2 or 3 burned temples and 1 burned lab by the end of year 2. Are those who want to use Order/Misfortune strategy ready for such?

[Calahan]

Originally Posted by Wrana

Thank you for pointing out. I'm sorry but it was said to me by someone among old-timer players, so I assumed that it was true.

Please give that old-timer player a slap from me

[Wrana]

Originally Posted by Calahan

Please give that old-timer player a slap from me

I'm afraid that would be physically impossible for some time.

[Xietor]

To give up the scales of 3 order/2 misfortune that dominated mp when i used to play, I think the heroes should be pretty nifty/exciting when you actually get one. Not be old, and less useful than many commanders other nations can buy in their castles. Which is why i always play with Throne of heroes(Middle age only) or Worthy Heroes.

Aside from the heroes, nations that NEED gold for a good start to survive in mp can rarely rely take turmoil. the loss of income is just too much.

While many here will bash this strategy, I have taken 3 order/3luck in large mp games with good players and won. The theory being that even with 3 order once you get a decent size area you will get 2-3 events a turn anyway. This strategy should not be tried with every race. In those cases i took 3 sloth 2 drain to offset the scales.

If you have trouble surviving the start of mp games, having 3 luck/3 order is also not going to be much use to you. I also sleep(not imprison) a tough pretender for the extra points.

[Verjigorm]

Originally Posted by Xietor

To give up the scales of 3 order/2 misfortune that dominated mp when i used to play, I think the heroes should be pretty nifty/exciting when you actually get one. Not be old, and less useful than many commanders other nations can buy in their castles. Which is why i always play with Throne of heroes(Middle age only) or Worthy Heroes.

Aside from the heroes, nations that NEED gold for a good start to survive in mp can rarely rely take turmoil. the loss of income is just too much.

While many here will bash this strategy, I have taken 3 order/3luck in large mp games with good players and won. The theory being that even with 3 order once you get a decent size area you will get 2-3 events a turn anyway. This strategy should not be tried with every race. In those cases i took 3 sloth 2 drain to offset the scales.

If you have trouble surviving the start of mp games, having 3 luck/3 order is also not going to be much use to you. I also sleep(not imprison) a tough pretender for the extra points.

I've heard Order-3 Luck-3 is a good combination, but that costs 160 points all by itself which presumes that you're going to take a less powerful pretender. I'm assuming you go Rainbow or Fountain with that?

With the Sloth-3 Drain-2 that would indicate your going to be looking for a strong research nation with crappy national units and the non-awake pretender also means you have to be able to survive early game... which leaves very few possibilites... I would be looking at Bogarus with an early rush to Spined Devils and a sleeping Fountain of Blood or a similar build with Mictlan.

[Wrana]

Originally Posted by Xietor

While many here will bash this strategy, I have taken 3 order/3luck in large mp games with good players and won. The theory being that even with 3 order once you get a decent size area you will get 2-3 events a turn anyway. This strategy should not be tried with every race. In those cases i took 3 sloth 2 drain to offset the scales.

If you have trouble surviving the start of mp games, having 3 luck/3 order is also not going to be much use to you. I also sleep(not imprison) a tough pretender for the extra points.

Yes, I've seen it preached by Baalz for some nations. AFAIU, though, such a build requires quite tough, costly units, mostly non-sacred. And this I'd say precludes taking Sloth in most cases. Though costly castles, which also require Sloth, would offset it somewhat...
Would you give an example of such a nation? I can think only of elephantes (and exclude LA Arcos) and maybe Vans/Tuatha here... Pythium is too resources-dependent...