New Water Spells

[Vynd]

These are all pretty cool. I especially like the idea of flooding spell that tramples people. That's nifty.

[Cohen]

The problem of Growth enhancing pop spells is that soon your dominion will kill grwoth.
So it's better to pump the population of a fixed percentage with that spell.

[Nagot Gick Fel]

Originally posted by Cohen:
The problem of Growth enhancing pop spells is that soon your dominion will kill grwoth.
So it's better to pump the population of a fixed percentage with that spell.

I think it's better to leave it as it is. The main purpose I see in these 'growth' spells is to provide supplies to campaigning armies, and the supplies you get from a province is strongly correlated to its growth scale. Moving your troops to a province that hosts a Well of Pestilence, and lacking Bags of Wine? Cast, and voilà!

[Cohen]

The time you move your army away, you have cast the spell.

I believe the problem of grwoth scale isn't supply, but too slow birthrate of people.

[Nagot Gick Fel]

Originally posted by Cohen:
The time you move your army away, you have cast the spell.

FYI, you can cast at province X and order your troops to move to X in the same turn. When your troops arrive next turn, the spell has just been cast and the growth scale has increased - just what you wanted to achieve.

[Endoperez]

I think the idea was that it is only effective for a short while. But yes, it does lessen the effect. Perhaps too much. I think the Rainmaker-spell should target the province of the casting mage only. Thematic reasons...
And warming the waters might not increase growth, as it is the cold water streams raising from the deeps at the shores of Peru and Norway that make the fish-population of those areas so rich. The spell itself seems quite right, though.

I don't like Steam. I could see it needing Air of Fire, but not Earth. Remember that Geysir, among others, is Water/Fire spell. Water/Earth would create mud, but that already is Earth-only spell. Maybe Water could, similarly, be the only path needed for the spells regarding Acids or maybe something else that could also need something else besides water. Acid might not be a good idea, though, as it would give Water two different types of damaging spells, in the same path, one of which can not be resisted at all!

I like your 'flooding' spell, but the name does not suit it very well. I'd like to keep the Waterfall in the name, but can't come up with anything suitable...

A scrying spell or two seems appopriate for water. Astral should still have atleast one scrying, for Crystal Sphere if for nothing else, but it could have the risk of feebleminding the user.

[Teraswaerto]

The Growth increasing spells could work a bit like Domes. The more gems you pump in the longer it Lasts.

[tinkthank]

K thanks so far.

As to the +growth spell, I figured it might affect a province's growth dominion the way that those special events affect a prov's luck dominion, for example, or the spell ??(forget name: melancholy?) affects a prov's sloth dominion....

And rainmaker voodoo hotshots in Haiti can make it rain on your parade a hundred kilometers away, heheh...

[tinkthank]

People seemed to feel there is a need for expanding water skills, here are some ideas from your humble servant TT.

1. Dance of the Rainmaker. Ritual Spell, cannot be cast underwater. 4 Water gems. Increases Growth in a friendly land target province.

2. Warm Waters. Ritual Spell. Can only be cast underwater. 3 water gems. Increases Growth in a friendly water target province.

3. Steam. 2 water gems, 200 Fatigue. Affects entire battlefield. Requires 3 water, 1 earth. Evocation or Alteration. Causes small cracks to appear on the battlefield, through which boiling steam will surge up. Randomly damages squares on a battlefield with steam damage.

4. Waterfall Flood. A mage can channel waters into a sudden flood which can affect 5+ squares on the battlefield, prec 0, range 25+. Units in the affected squares have a chance of being washed away (treat as: Trample) or immobilized as they attempt to hold their balance against the flood. Aquatic units are immune to this spell.
EDIT: Treat as Trample from a size 6 unit. Perhaps Aquatic and Amphibian units are treated as having a size+3 bonus (thus small units might still be knocked away in the flood?)?

Feel free to comment, flame, and add your own ideas.

[ June 05, 2004, 12:37: Message edited by: tinkthank ]

[LintMan]

I posted these water spell suggestions in a clam nerfing thread a while back, but they didn't get much discussion (except some encouragement/suggestions from Gandalf -thanks Gandalf!). The suggestions fit this topic, though, so I'll repost them here.

First, my thoughts on water magic:
- I agree with Norfleet's point if there were better uses for water gems, there'd be less clam hording.
- I think water magic is pretty good combat-wise, and it's in ritual magic and items where water is somewhat lacking, which is why water gems aren't that useful.
- That said, I think what water needs would be to have some good high end water spells to make it worth saving up those water gems for. I'm thinking mainly of things like maybe a beneficial global effect spell (ie: soemthing very useful like FotA or GoH), a non-ocean-based global effect spell (ie: doesn't just effect ocean or coastal provinces), some high-end amphib summons, some mid-range amphib summons that don't have gold upkeep cost (a huge downside to sea trolls!), a remote summon, and/or some powerful but pricey magic items. And maybe a transport spell of some kind.

Some quick ideas:

* "Harvest Rains" - increases supply in all provinces, according to dominion strength
* "Fountain of Youth" - increases pop growth in all provinces, according to dom strength.
* "Water of Life" - creates/attracts new life to a target province. (Ie: bring a pop 0 province back to life)
* "Weather Control" - caster specifies preferred heat/cold scale, and globally, all provinces are pushed towards it. (I'm thinking it'd be a weaker effect than Illwinter, but more flexible)
(Gandalf suggested the cool idea that this could add some protection against some of the bad-weather negative events)
* "Ice Castle" - It magically never completely melts, but its defense is based on province heat/cold scale.
* "Sea Nymphs" - mid-high summon: amphib, awe +0, charm attack
* "Summon giant crocodile(s)" - low-mid range summon, amphib, maybe comparable strength to nature lion or kithaironic lion spells.
* "Summon Yeti" - mid or high-end thugish summon, possibly an SC-able chassis.
* "Call Nessie" - high-end amphib summon, maybe comparable toughness/cost to Tarrasque
* "Staff of Frost" - 40 water gem item, casts falling frost
* "Helm of Liquid Form" - 80 water gem item, reduces all physical damage taken by 75%
* "Staff of Speed" - 40-80 Water gem item, casts quickness on units up to say range 20, area 1-2
* "Waterways" - transport an army from any coastal province to any other coastal province. I don't remember who originally suggested this one, but I like it.
* "Hidden Currents" - transport an army from any underwater province to any other underwater province.