Whats your opinion on experimental gear in MBT?

MarkSheppard · #1 October 4th, 2005, 10:19 PM

I have plenty of data on a lot of cancelled/proposed/
experimental US projects from Dick Hunnicutt's books;
is anyone interested in seeing these things as part of
a speculative mod for WinMBT?

LCAX1
136,400 lbs gross weight
60,000 lbs payload (30 tons)
9 hours of water travel at 10 MPH with 1,800 gallons of fuel
20 MPH land speed
Capable of carrying 3 x M113s

LVTU-X2 "Goliath"
1/8" thick steel hull
3/8" steel armor crew compartment
296,000 lbs gross weight
120,000 lb payload (60 tons)
2 x 500 hp engines
4 x 36" wide tracks
13 MPH land speed
7 MPH water speed

Early Validation drawing by General Motors of their XM-1 Proposal; before the 25mm
Bushmaster was eventually deleted.

From Page 212 of Sherman by Hunnicutt:

As a result of the crisis in Normandy, Brigadier General Joseph A. Holly returned to the United States in July 1944. As Chief of the Armor Section for the European Theater of Operations, he was directed by General Eisenhower to expedite the production and shipment of more powerfully armed tanks and tank destroyers, particularly those with 90mm guns. During his visit to Detroit Arsenal, General Holly viewed a Sherman armed with the 90mm gun M3. This was an M4 fitted with a Pershing type 90mm gun turret. Since both tanks had 69 inch turret rings, such an installation required only stowage changes and modifications to obtain adequate clearance between the turret assembly and some components on the tank hull. The experimental vehicle was fitted with the early vertical volute spring suspension and the 16-9; 16 inch wide track. No doubt any production of this tank would have used the new horizontal volute spring suspension with the 23 inch tracks to reduce the ground pressure. A traveling gun lock for the 90mm gun was mounted on the front armor plate.

I have a lot of stuff on my plate now in terms of other stuff, and I'm gauging the interest to see if it's worth
my time in doing the icons for them...

IanWilliams · #2 October 8th, 2005, 05:27 PM

I would love to see some of this stuff that never made it out of prototype in a "What-if" Mod

Other potential units for the US

AH-56 Cheyenne
MBT-70

Ian

Sewter · #3 October 12th, 2005, 11:13 PM

Experimental weapons are really neat for the 'what if-ers'. Here is one that the honorable USMC researched:

LAV HYDRA rocket launcher

In 1986, an LAV-25 was fitted with a 19-round HYDRA 70 70 mm (2.75 in) rocket launcher on the right side of the turret with powered elevation and depression (-200 to +600 mils). Approximately 100 unguided rockets were successfully fired during trials in July 1986. The rockets are identical to those fired from aircraft and helicopters and would be used in both the surface and anti-helicopter roles. This was a trials installation and there are no plans to fit this to production vehicles.

Sorry, no pictures...

MarkSheppard · #4 October 13th, 2005, 09:07 AM

Speaking of LAVs, did you know that the US Army
actually type classified the LAV-25 as the M1047?

Congress however cancaled the funding for the LAV-25
and the Army withdrew from the program; but the USMC
managed to obtain funds for the other versions.

MarkSheppard · #5 October 13th, 2005, 09:12 AM

Quote:

In 1986, an LAV-25 was fitted with a 19-round HYDRA 70 70 mm (2.75 in) rocket launcher on the right side of the turret with powered elevation and depression (-200 to +600 mils). Approximately 100 unguided rockets were successfully fired during trials in July 1986. The rockets are identical to those fired from aircraft and helicopters and would be used in both the surface and anti-helicopter roles. This was a trials installation and there are no plans to fit this to production vehicles.

I've found it in my book ARMORED CAR.

Apparently you speak of the early prototype for the LAV-AD,
in which they wanted a 25mm gun, quad launcher for stingers,
and a 7 tube launcher for Hydra 70s.

The FMC proposal had two seven tube Hydra 70 launchers,
while the General Electric proposal only had a single
Hydra launcher.

The testing program showed that the Hydra was ineffective
in the anti-helicopter role, and it was replaced with a
second quad stinger launcher.

Sewter · #6 October 15th, 2005, 07:32 PM

Wow! That really is neat stuff! Your book has some great info. Some of prototype vehicles are really out there, aren't they?

kevineduguay1 · #7 October 16th, 2005, 08:41 AM

What about the M113 mounting Hellfire missiles, or the M1A4 Abrams with the 140mm gun? Im not sure if the game can model a guided tank gun round with a 8000 meter range though!

Also saw a picture of a M113 with a Russian turret mounting a 100mm gun, 30mm gun, and all the other Russian goodies plus extra armor to stop HEAT rounds! It was titled "Russian can do!" on a M113 site. I'll go back to look it up and post it here or at least get the pic.

dwmalesevich · #8 October 16th, 2005, 12:42 PM

They also had an early version of the Avenger with the rocket pods.

Dave Malesevich
SFC E-7 USA-Ret.

kevineduguay1 · #9 October 16th, 2005, 04:31 PM

As promised, a M113 with Russian turret. This is no joke!

PlasmaKrab · #10 October 17th, 2005, 04:58 AM

Quote:

kevineduguay1 said:
As promised, a M113 with Russian turret. This is no joke!

Not quite, I guess you could call it this way, the base is the Turkish FNSS TIFV, fitted with the Baschka-U evolved BMP-3 turret, which has been presented at IDEX 2005, apparently targetting the UAE market. Now everyone has to walk hand in hand to conquer the global markets of 'land systems'!

When I read your post I half awaited some M-113A1 retrofitted with a BRDM2 turret or something like that!