Quote:
Originally Posted by istol
what you think is best artillery against dug in troops ?
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You really have to define what you mean by "best" in any question, to make it a meaningful one.
The best killer of dug in troops is the heavier shells. However, the kill rate is still rather low, and the shell rate (and thus the number of hits as well) will be lower than for quick-fire arty. Plus, heavier shells tear up the ground, and so grant cover to the defender from shell-holes, which a human player especially might exploit. (I sometimes use heavy arty to dig out a cluster of shell scrapes near the objective in a delay or meeter, for the APC infantry to exploit in holding it when they get there. If my opponent does it for me, great!).
As others have mentioned, the best way to remove dug in troops is to keep them suppressed, and close and kill with your own forces.
For this, you want arty that fires at a higher rate, and has a suppressive effect. Generally, that means arty in the 85-90mm range (e.g. the 25 pounder). Also mortars of the 81mm and especially 120mm types. The higher ROF means more shells in the target zone, hence more suppression as that is based more on the "bangs per minute" ratio of effective enough bangs close enough to the troops.
On map mortars and possibly SP 105 (abbots etc, the USA in the 60s have a wonderful one with loads of ammo on board) are good suppression assets. They can be resupplied!. 120mm Mortars usually have enough range to dominate at least most of the battlefield without need to relocate. SP equipment is really good as it is mobile - so keep them scooting about if the enemy fires CB on them.
Also, since you are trying to close to 100M or less of the enemy troops the smaller arty is also best for the attacker that is "leaning into the barrage" - any shorts that drop into own forces as a result of this will tend to be less effective than receiving a "friendly" 203mm brick.
Dug in troops that are in ROUT or RETREAT status, but that are in entrenchments (also rough etc, anything "protective" in terms of terrain) will generally hold their position as "neutralised" troops rather than run away in WinSP games (in the original game they would simply retreat/rout even if the enemy were nowhere near). Once the enemy is known to be close (say 200m) -
then these may decide to do a runner rather than cower neutralised at the bottom of the trench. Unlike other SP code, we have surrender as an option - troops in retreat or worse status who are within 50M of a healthy opponent may well surrender instead of doing a runner.
So - neutralise them with a barrage of lighter (quick firing) arty over several turns as you approach, lean into the barrage (accept casualties from drop shorts) to get close whilst they are still stunned, and shoot them out of their trenches/let the badly affected ones decide to run and accept surrender of those within a hex or so who have had enough. Once out of cover, hack them in the back. Keep the arty dropping just behind the contact line to also chivvy such retreaters along.
Your heavy arty you should reserve until you identify hard points in the defence, ie bunkers and MBT. When in reserve and not firing they may fire counter battery for you if experienced and enough range. Once identified, give them it all - "drop the hammer" on these in concentrated fire-blows. Heavy arty can at least do mobility kills (even if dug in), and fire-power kills, if not killing them outright. A tank with its socks blown off is not a happy little camper, and the crew may bail and run when badly suppressed and enemy close by. Also use the heavies to drop the hammer on any identified on-map arty locations, especially any defender cluster or MRL (see later). As outlined above - try to keep the big bricks from the close-support mission as their drop shorts are large, and you as the attacker are in the open.
The MRL is not a great deal of use against dug in troops. In the advance it is a good weapon as the enemy will not be in prepared positions. MRL are horrible weapons to try to use in close support of the attack as they have a larger dispersion that tube arty, and so you will tend to get dropped short on much more. I seem to recall that the original code name for the MRLS system when in development was "Assault Breaker", and this is where MRL
excel since the attacker tends to clump up for assaults in a reasonably predictable position (behind the heavy barrages!). Use concentrated MRL fire to break up his assaults when defending, it will really make his day..
Go for mobile MRL launchers rather than fixed, and only use the dug in positions initially (or return to them later once the enemy has pounded the ground). MRL that fire
will attract incoming, so do not stick around. Relocate to a new position, and bomb up from the ammo trucks there after firing, then move the ammo trucks off before firing and relocating once more. Always bomb up to their full load before firing, don't reveal the new fire position till you have a worthwhile target to loose the fully bombed-up battery on. Having a lateral road in the rear of your map is great for a defender with SP-MRL as it aids dispersal considerably. (A human opponent may predict that convoys of scooting SP_MRL and ammo trucks will be using the road, and so lay predicted stonks along it).
As an attacker cluster ammo is not useful for close support for the same reasons as MRL and heavy arty. Any drop shorts will tend to give your exposed assault troops a really bad hair day!. Use cluster arty as for heavy arty - splat any prime defensive hard-shell troops with it to prepare a position well before you reach contact. Use your cluster batteries to CB any detected on-map defending cluster arty and MRL - those are double-plus prime arty targets.
As a defender, cluster arty is an assault breaker munition. Initial targeting should be on any clustered bunches of loaded APC you can detect approaching, or armoured engineer vehicles. Try not to fire it on your own positions if the enemy has managed to merge, but it may be necessary. But try to keep the cluster ammo lashing his assault positions just in front of your dug-in troops. If you have access to SP-arty with cluster as the defender, then
buy some, with some ammo vehicles and adopt shoot and scoot tactics.
As the attacker try to choose a reasonably narrow part of his front to break through - a max of about 20 hexes wide. Against a human defender you
may need to at least threaten another breakthrough area to stop him moving reserves to the intended point. Choose an area that is not able to be supported by direct fires from other areas (fight through a wood, or village, or a narrow valley). Or make your own defilade with smoke, if he has no access to thermal imaging sights. Choose just one objective cluster of the three to go for initially, and concentrate almost all your troops in that area. Punch through the gap and get into his rear areas with your mobile troops to sweep the other 2 clusters from behind - the "expanding torrent" of JFC Fuller's Plan 1919 is still valid today.
As the defender - any off map arty should probably remain passive as he fires any barrages, in order to try to pick off some batteries in counter-battery fire. Keep your on-map arty assets hidden as well until you have identified his main thrust lines, and also maybe some on-map arty to snipe at (but he will likely have too many to really deal with). Enemy engineering assets are prime targets, should you be relying on field defences (mines, wire, ditches). Drop the hammer on any engineers in a threatening place - give them a concentrated fire-blow from all available arty assets. Once you have identified wherever he is trying to make his breakthrough, then drop fire-blows just behind his barrage to break his attacking concentrations.
As a defender, you are dug in and the enemy troops are not. So you can afford friendly arty drop-shorts
far more than he can. In fact, you can fire on your own positions - especially with light arty and mortars and get only a headache while damaging the exposed attackers, as they try to merge with your defensive zones. Try to time a MRL strike just as his infantry has debussed and is massing for the assault - or is even in the middle of your defensive lines. Have predicted targets as "Final Defensive Fire (FDF)" points on the front line (or even slightly inside!) of your defences to aid dropping defensive fire blows on exposed enemy.
For the defender, a heavy battery may be useful - these are better at killing AFV than the 85-105mm, especially lighter ones (APC). If left passive in order to fire CB missions, they will do more damage than light arty. The attacking AFV will be in the open and prime targets are his loaded APCs and any engineer vehicles. A mobility kill on an attacking vehicle is just fine for the defender - so if you identify decent sized groupings of these, then splatter them even with light arty/mortars. Do not try for outright kills as you just want immobilisations - a non moving vehicle is almost useless to the attacker, so concentrate on blowing the socks off as many runners as you can as far away from the defence as you can.
As the attacker - any counter attack makes
you the defender, as the attacker has given up his prepared positions and is now moving in the open. You may be enjoying his defensive positions that you have now taken. The troops you have left to secure such a position may be beaten-up formations, the rest are off expanding the torrent. The coin has now flipped. So MRL, cluster and heavy arty assets become most useful in that situation to break up his armoured counter-attacks. Pure infantry counter attacks can be broken up by anything that goes "bang".
For both sides - an experienced cluster ammo equipped MLRS off map battery can be a very dangerous counter-battery asset. Leave such passive for most of the game to fire CB missions and only use any remaining ammo on the map in the late game if needed (e.g as a counter-counter attack asset when attacking).
Cheers
Andy
assaulting
Hybrid Mode
