Brainstorm: EA/MA/LA Arabian/Islamic themed nation

[Squirrelloid]

Decided I'd take a stab at a mod, especially since no one seems to be doing one with this theme. This is a definite work in progress, and I'm on the look out for good ideas. I think I have the best feel for the EA version right now.

I still need a name (or set of names) for the nation, but I have some subtitles in mind at least. I'll use $Name for the nation name throughout, unless inspiration strikes me.

Notes on 'genie'. The proper singular is jinni. The plural is jann. Herein I'll be using jinni/jann to refer to a particular type of 'genie'. All the following are considered 'genies': jinni, ifrit, ghul, shaytan. 'Genies' need not eat.

Note on language: I want to get arabic names for most unit types, but i'd like them rendered in roman characters, and sadly most online translations render directly into arabic characters which I can't read.

EA: $Name, Arabian Nights

The empire of the Jann kings, powerful beings of pure magic who rule native humans and lesser jann. Some humans have taken to worshipping the jann, and these humans are given privileges and bade to rule over other men. Many of these less fortunates are slaves of the state or powerful individuals.

The jann kings have concealed the awakening of the nascent god, and use their pretended divinity and magical puissance to extend the influence of their true master.

Historical note: Inspired by some Arabian Nights tales and put into a framework that makes internal sense

Strengths and weaknesses
Units: Cheap chaffe, ranged units expensive and magical, generally poor armor.
Priests: Weak
Magic: Strong fire/air/astral, some death/blood

Units:
Slave Infantry
Really cheap, weak, poor weapons, no armor, poor morale.

Desert Nomads
Stealthy, wasteland survival, good weapons, poor armor, good morale

Camel Riders
Light cavalry, wasteland survival, sword, poor armor, good morale

Temple Warriors
sacred, good armor, sword + shield, good morale

Lesser Ifrit
Capitol only, expensive, throws fire bolts, flies, magical being

Lesser Jinni
Sacred, capitol only, expensive, flies, throws lightning, magical being

Commanders:
Nomad Scout
40Ld scout, wasteland survival

Sheikh
40Ld commander, wasteland survival

Mounted Sheikh
40Ld mounted commander, wasteland survival

Priest of the Smokeless Fire
Human. Sacred. H1 +50% ?A +50% ?F. 80Ld

Shaytan
Mage. Stealthy +20. Air and maybe Death or Blood. (A2 + 10% ?DB)? Flies and can fly in storms.

Ifrit
Mage. Fire and Blood or Death. (F2 + ?FDB or F1 + 2?FDB)

Jinni.
Mage. Sacred. Astral + ? (maybe S1 + 100% ?ASD + 10% ?ASDB). Flies.

Jinni King
Top-tier mage. Sacred. Capitol only. Astral + Air + random anything. Flies.

----------------------------

MA: $Name, Warriors of the Faith

Over time the grip of the jann kings weakened on the outlying provinces, but the jann were losing interest in the world, and secluding themselves from it, and so didn't notice. And as they withdrew their presence the worship of them began to falter. In this crisis of faith there emerged a prophet to both humans and jann, bringing the holy word of a newly awakening god. The human empire grew strong, expanding the word of god by diplomacy and the sword. The jann remained connected to them through the worship of this new pretender, although they now needed to be called by powerful clerics.

Historical note: Inspired by islamic tradition, history, Haroum al-Rashid, and Neil Gaiman's take on him in the Sandman

Unit note: There's a real mixed bag of units I could choose to use, so I've left this purposely vague for now. As everything from camel cavalry to elephants to various types of infantry make sense, this needs narrowing down.

Strengths and weaknesses
Units:
Priests: Strong
Magic: predominantly Air/Earth/Fire/Water, some Death

Units:


Commanders:
Scout

80 Ld Commander

120 Ld Mounted Commander

80 Ld "War Priest", H2

Hashishin
Stealthy. Assassin. Sacred. H1X1 (possibly X = Death)

Alchemist
Probably as per existing unit.

Imam
H3 F2E1 +200% FAWE, sacred

Vizier
A2F2 + 200%FAWED + 10%D, capitol only

--------------

LA: $Name, subtitle

I'm reasonably certain I want this to be crusader era islamic armies, but possibly early Ottoman Empire. I need to resolve some things about MA yet to really start thinking about this era. Ie, if MA ends up covering the same ground crusader era would, there's little reason to use it for LA.

--------------

National Spells:
Call Ghul:
Commander Mage with D + B. Can shapeshift into a Hyena. Stealthy and Assassin.

Genius Locus:
Completely immobile mage commander summon (no teleport if possible). Is the 'spirit' of a location. Might need to make this summon one of a handful of uniques, because I want each one to modify local scales and I don't know if I can randomly generate such an effect. Only one per location if possible.

EA 'Genie' commanders become summons for MA/LA

----------------

Heroes:
Iblis (EA, maybe others)
Mythological: devil analog, but a jinni rather than a fallen angel.
Game: mage, Air + Death + Blood

Jabir ibn Hayyan (MA, LA)
Historical: Alchemist, father of chemistry
Game: Alchemist-type mage hero

Sulayman (likely LA)
Mythological: King Solomon. In arabic tradition he bound most/all the jann into an object, and could command them to do his bidding. Important later in demonology (see: Solomon's Key, Solomon's Seal) (I don't care to comment on the nature or reality of a historical solomon).
Game: mage hero, possibly air/astral or earth/astral?

Sinbad (any)
Mythological: Duh
Game: Is it possible to enable pseudo-magic for site searching only? Because that would seem to be the most appropriate.

Scheherazade (EA, MA?)
Mythological: More duh
Game: Powerful Astral?

Aladdin (MA)
Mythological: ibid
Game: some unique items (Ring, Lamp)?

Ok, that's probably enough for now...

[Stavis_L]

Sounds like a great idea; might want to ping a couple of the other people who've started in on this theme; see:

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=43380

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=38268

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=34687

Just a few other things:

Flying Carpets and the Magic Lamp (w/associated Djinni) are already forgeable items.

RE: heroes

Sulayman - if he has dominion over the jann, perhaps he could domsummon (or have summon action) to generate them as troops?

Sinbad should definitely have sailing. Perhaps he could increase the luck scale?

Scheherazade - rather than (just) a mage, she should be a spy and/or assassin? (her description is as a good wife + storyteller, daughter of the vizier, with excellent insight as to the sultan's woes.)

Aladdin - needs stealth. Perhaps should domsummon his "40 thieves"?

[Squirrelloid]

Originally Posted by Stavis_L

Aladdin - needs stealth. Perhaps should domsummon his "40 thieves"?

That would be Ali Baba. Totally different, although also a plausible hero.

And the 40 thieves are his adversaries, not his companions...

[Stavis_L]

Originally Posted by Squirrelloid

That would be Ali Baba. Totally different, although also a plausible hero.

And the 40 thieves are his adversaries, not his companions...

Whoops! I blame an education rooted in Saturday morning cartoons...

[Wrana]

Also:
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=35105
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=38342
As you can see, we came to a conclusion that the EA nation should be mainly genie-based, with primitive desert nomads as sidekicks (and yes, I agree that they should be raiders).
MA I think should be something like 10th century Arab states of Middle East - with both city and nomadic troops, plus ghulam slave warriors. I used some Persian patterns in my version (Pekhlevans, etc.) though I'm not sure now these were quite in place here.
LA was based on Ottomanic Empire quite shamelessly.
Unfortunately, we had a pesonality clash and this stopped to be a common project. Still, I have MA & LA almost complete except for pics. Look them up (the 2nd link) and say what you think.
Also. Of course, genie should be summons outside of EA. By the way, genie in my variant are also partly Persian - mainly because I have more sources on them. Genie locus I like, but am not sure about where it comes from. I remember genie countries in 1001, but these usually lay "at the edge of the world"... Also, after-Mohammed times should get both faithful genies and infidel ones. I think that the latter should be mages with more broad skills (and maybe slightly more levels), but the former retain priestly powers. In EA there should be no such division.
Considering heroes - I am not sure about EA, but for MA/LA I made Old Man of the Mountain (heretic who still domsummons his disciples - it's up to player whether to keep him at home or use to undermine enemy... ), Hoja Nasreddin - a Middle Asia folklore character with some cool abilities, plus, of course - Abd al-Hazred (someone should write Necronomicon)! I am not sure what to do with Khaliffs - they can be multiheroes, or prophets... Ideally, they should have high H levels, be present one at a time, but be replaceble if one is killed. Recently I saw an idea to highjack, say, Abyssian prophet for such a purpose. Unfortunately, this makes a mod not usable together with some nation in basegame (maybe it's possible to use unit from another era, though).
Also a question - how good are you with pixelart? I made some attempts at this and am ready to allow my pics to be used in your mod if you allow the same (not sure whether you need mine, of course ). I think that Aezeal will also allow to use his pictures, but you better ask him, of course...

[Squirrelloid]

Ah geez, I forgot all about the Ogre... That should definitely work its way into the EA somehow...

Thanks for the links - looks like most of those projects died a slow death? How encouraging...

[Sombre]

Yep they all sorta burnt out just as they started getting interesting.

Have to have free time and a little bit of willpower to get a mod finished.

[Squirrelloid]

Wrana:
Ach, more abandoned projects!

I used to be passable at pixel art. Its been years since i've done any. Mostly I found its something that just requires a lot of patience and a willingness to tinker. Which means if I can crib from other people's work, it certainly wouldn't hurt, but I think I'm capable of eventually producing something that I could live with.

Regarding ages:
Obviously I agree that a jann-dominated EA is a good idea. However, this actually gives me four ages worth of material, which is where i start dithering over where the division between MA/LA is in the OP.

EA: Jann Kings
MA: Jihad - spreading of Islam and the early caliphate. (Think 700-1000AD) Probably work a city of wonders themed baghdad in here.
LA1: Crusades era. Well developed military, powerful cavalry, etc...
LA2: Early Ottoman Empire. This has the signature disadvantage of require firearms *and* cannon. (Talking about the turks without talking about cannon is stupid. They emerge into history with the defeat of Byzantium - a siege famous for the use of rather large cannon). I'm not sure I want to deal with making bullet/cannonball graphics either, although it would be a rather different nation...

Maybe this is worth 2 separate LA nations, and give the Turks their due as a separate power? (Makes historical sense as well).

And of course, Persia has enough material to deserve its own mod nation and not intrude here!

The funny thing about fantasy in general is that it has this weird ahistorical idea that truly heavy armor and crossbows predate the use of cannons. As our earliest evidence for cannon use goes back to the 13th century, this is patently false, and firearms followed not long afterwards. They wouldn't become dominant considerations on the battlefield for a century or two, but they were certainly present. I would expect the LA to have cannons and a firearm unit for many of the more military-focused nations.

Genius Locus:
The idea is pre-islam, and pan-mesopotamian. Actually the idea of jinni is too. The term Genius Locus is latin, as the idea was transmitted to Rome following its conquest of the holy land area. A genius in latin is a type of spirit entity, so genius locus is literally a 'location spirit' (with the appropriate connotations on spirit from genius). The latin word genius is actually the immediate root for the english 'genie'. (Latin genius may be derived from jinni, although its hard to know for certain).

[Squirrelloid]

My first attempt at Dominions pixel art. A nomad light cavalry, horse mounted - not sure if i actually have a use for such a thing yet, but its a useful exercise in doing white robes/turban with shading.

Note that doing white with shading is hard. (I paint miniatures - this is a problem there too). I've chosen to shade it into yellow. I could make it look more white by reducing the shading... not sure how good of a trade that is at this resolution as it would just start looking like a white blob. I could also move it more greyscale, but that just ends up looking greyish instead of yellowish. This resolution is really problematic.

Proportion problem with the bow arm present in the original sprite i cribbed for this purpose...

Yes, its the attack animation. That way if it came out completely horrid even if I used it you wouldn't see it for long.

(I have it as a tga too, but png struck me as easier for viewing.)

Edit: Oops, i need to get rid of the lance, probably... la la la.

[Burnsaber]

Originally Posted by Squirrelloid

Note that doing white with shading is hard. (I paint miniatures - this is a problem there too).

Well, not that much. There is no such thing as white in Dom 3 units, it's too bright. Everything is mainly shades of gray, giving an impression of being white (see my avatar for example).