OOB Finland

Kone · #1 July 14th, 2005, 07:08 PM

Some notes:

-Finnish air force hornets do not currently have a2g weapons (just the gun), at least to my knowing. These are planned at the present. They will appear 2010 or later.

-Helicopters are unarmed, NH90 may have door guns.

-Jaeger squad consists of 7 men (or women), not 8. Leader, machine gun pair, AT pair and rifle pair. Not sure when this structure was introduced... Possibly with the introduction of BMP:s in the early 80's?

-Pioneer squad also consists of 7 fighters. The pioneers I've chatted with have not been trained for APILAS at all.

-There are no HE rounds for APILAS or 66 KES 75/88 (=M-72 LAW).

-Apilas team (2 men) carries 8! disposable rocket launchers, rifles and hand grenades. Being over a meter long and weighting nearly 10 kilos, APILAS is not a weapon to be carried in such quantities. 2 launchers per head practical maximum.

-Squads generally carry too many rocket lauchers. Typically there would be 4/sqd, sometimes 8 66 KeS LAWs.

-Reserve sections... well finnish army IS a reserve army so I erased these. If wanted, something like home guard sections could used in most extreme situations. These would not be unlike volkssturm -obsolete weapons and low exp and morale.

-Some units and weapons missing (.338 sniper rifle 2000, shotgun...)

Please, post comments & corrections!

SCAJolly · #2 July 14th, 2005, 07:18 PM

Very nice information.

Would you have any dates available for the units?

Kone · #3 July 15th, 2005, 04:59 AM

According to finnish net sources, jaeger sections consisted of 8 men in the 60's and 70's. I made a guess and chopped off that poor assistant leader in the beginning of 81. Same with pioneers. This is only a guess.

Sniper rifle 2000 (SAKO TRG 42) entered surprisingly year 2000. Better range than earlier weapons. 12.7mm sniper rifle 2000 also exists (Barrett) but is propably used to detonate unexploded bombs from safe distance.

DRG · #4 July 15th, 2005, 10:14 AM

Quote:

Kone said:
Some notes:

-Reserve sections... well finnish army IS a reserve army so I erased these. If wanted, something like home guard sections could used in most extreme situations. These would not be unlike volkssturm -obsolete weapons and low exp and morale.

Please, post comments & corrections!

You may ave already noted from the Info tab of MOBHack that we've already had a number of Finns "correct" the OOB in the past and what you are looking at is the result. Also, you deleted the reserve formations.... those ARE the "home guard" that are...... "used in most extreme situations" with "obsolete weapons and low exp and morale." And did you consider that the AI **may** actually use those formations in some circumstances before you deleted them???

Don

SCAJolly · #5 July 15th, 2005, 10:51 AM

There are normally different division/brigade/regiment/batallion and company structures, depending on the year, the equipment, politics, etc. What Kone refers to as corrections here, correcting what has already been corrected, is probably limited to certain brigades in the Finnish Army.

DRG · #6 July 15th, 2005, 11:02 PM

My point was this OOB in particular has already been gone over a number of times by a number of people. Units and formations should not be deleted on assumptions or units altered by guessing. "Reserve" formations are second or third line troops. There are many ways they could be named and in this case they were named "Reserves "

Don

Kone · #7 July 17th, 2005, 04:33 PM

In finnish army jaeger organization represents the "first"- or "a"-class troops. Infantry units are second- or b-class. Jaeger fighters are transferred to infantry organization when they reach the age of appx. 35 remaining in infantry organization until they're around 60 years old.

Theoretically the c-class troops indeed exist in finland. After leaving the defence forces' organization, these men could still be called in. However, there are several reasons why I see this being highly unlikely.

There is no ready organizational stucture for them. Their military value would be extremely low, as they haven't been exercising for (maybe tens of) years.

Plus, finnish defence forces' wartime maximun, meaning the amax number of men mobilized has been greatly decreased (To appx 490000, 350 000 from 2008 on). Therefore, if extra men are needed, there are still more capable men to call in than these c-class troops.

To tell the truth, I did not try out if AI would pick these units or not. If these reserve troops are kept available, the rarity factor should be set low.