Urgent. Host Cheating: Problem and Solution.

Saber Cherry · #1 January 25th, 2004, 03:41 AM

Dominions I and II have a serious flaw that allows host-based cheating, such that it is currently impossible to have a cheat-free game, unless a 3rd-party provides hosting (generally unlikely).

The method:

The host copies the game data to a new folder, and force-hosts. He is able to attack every adjacent province to see exactly what the opponents have, or even build a large army and conquer the entire map, seeing everything - capitol locations, pretenders, theme choices, army locations, lab locations, and so forth. He could even patrol vigorously in every province to find stealthy units or stealthy armies. The simplest information to find, of course, would be opponents' next turn orders... negating the possiblity of sneak attacks. Even on the first turn, the host could try attacking each adjacent province to see if a victory was probable.

The solution:

In the game settings screen (Indy strength, site frequency, world richness, etc) a "Force Host" option could be present, and default to "enabled". A cheating host will ALWAYS be able to see one turn ahead, if he so desires. However, if "Force Host" and "Master Password" are disabled, so that the host could never force-host, one future turn is the maximum he could see... which is a huge, but not insurmountable advantage.

Hopefully this will be integrated into 2.07+, so that semi-secure games are possible...

-Cherry

Zapmeister · #2 January 25th, 2004, 04:23 AM

Hmmm. Is there really much to be gained by reducing a fabulous advantage to a merely huge advantage?

I think players will always be forced to decide whether or not they trust their host, and whether or not they want to play in games run by a potentially untrustworthy host.

It is, after all, just a game. What's the point of winning if you secretly exploited your role as host to do it? None that I can see.

Norfleet · #3 January 25th, 2004, 04:31 AM

I don't really think this is a problem. The host will always be able to cheat like this in some way, and one of the primary problems of military intelligence is trying to use information without making it known that you know: Often, even if you know about a surprise attack, you have to let it happen as one anyway, or else they'll know you know.

From a practical standpoint, your proposed solution would fail to address the matter anyway: An unscrupulous host can simply start a copy of the game on timed-host, and let it host/set the system clock to induce it to host, thereby seeing future turns anyway.

The real problem is deeper than that: If you have a host which cheats, you're playing with a jerk, as your host. Let's say he can no longer cheat, so his lack of skill is something that he can no longer hide: He'll get wiped out early, then throw a tantrum and kill your game. So if you're playing with a good and reliable, or third party host, you needn't worry about cheating. If you're playing with a git, your problem is there: Either you'll have to give him preferential treatment that's just as good as letting him cheat, so he doesn't get wiped out of the game and kill your game in the process, or you'll just have to let him cheat.

Either way, this is far from the most pressing issue facing Dominions II. If you're playing with smacktards as your host, you're not going to be in for a positive gaming experience, either way.

[ January 25, 2004, 02:31: Message edited by: Norfleet ]

Saber Cherry · #4 January 25th, 2004, 05:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Zapmeister:
[QB] Hmmm. Is there really much to be gained by reducing a fabulous advantage to a merely huge advantage?

When I posted I thought I had a solution - it was not until 1/2-way thru that I realized it was only a partial solution

Oh well...

#5 January 25th, 2004, 05:39 AM

Don't worry Cherry! I'll only cheat if I'm playing with you!

Saber Cherry · #6 January 25th, 2004, 09:42 AM

Oh, wait, I figured it out. OK:

"Force Host Disabled"

and

"Master Password Disabled"

will allow perfectly cheatproof network play. Nothing, to my knowledge, can prevent host cheating in pbem. But still, allowing for the possibility of cheatproof play is... in my opinion... more than just a good idea. Obviously, it's best to play with a host who is trustworthy, but in the shady Vegas $50k Dominions II blitz games I play... one can never be too careful, ya know...

-Cherry