Vanheim Pretenders: Allfather and Asynya

Cohen · #1 May 31st, 2004, 05:54 PM

This topic is about those 2 pretenders.

They're both unique for Vanheim ... but I see Vanheim playing only with Odin Allfather ...

The Asynya is pretty themathic, but I've never seen it ...

I don't play usually Vanheim, but I suppose or Allfather is too strong compared to Asynya (well I believe for 125 points, he's very cheap, or at least he has good stats combined with a mid-low new path cost), even if Asynya costs 50 points less, she hasn't glamour, hide, fly, has a single starting path with a new path cost of 50 compared to 30 of Allfather.
And Allfather is starting with an affliction, that can be healed, so its base stats will raise too in late game.

Tuidjy · #2 June 2nd, 2004, 02:13 AM

RIGHT! Allfather is too strong! He is beating
up my poor Vampire Queen in her own domain, so
he is OBVIOUSLY too strong. NERF THE BASTARD!

NERF! NERF! NERF!!!!!

WHAAAAAAHHHHH!

Ahhh... Let me catch my breath before I start
calling for nerfing Nataraja, because once we
get rid of the Allfather, he is next.

Or is it the ghost king, the carrion dragon, or...

[ June 02, 2004, 01:14: Message edited by: Tuidjy ]

Vynd · #3 June 2nd, 2004, 02:24 AM

Now now, Tuidjy, be fair... He didn't actually say that the Allfather should be made weaker. Just that he's way better than the Asynya. I can't remember the Asynya's stats well enough to judge how right Cohen is. But I don't know how much it really matters. There are lots of nations where one of the national pretenders is better than the other. And there are plenty of non-national pretenders that are as good or better than most of the national pretenders.

Now if Cohen wants to argue that the Asynya is so bad, for its cost, that there's never a reason to use her as opposed to the other options, that'd be a little different.

Tuidjy · #4 June 2nd, 2004, 02:27 AM

In one corner we have Odin Allfather, who traded
his eye for knowledge, who, astride Sleipnir,
will lead the Aesir on Ragnarok. The top dog of
one of the greatest and best known pantheons,
about whom more stories are told every day.

In the other corner, we have Asynya. The, ah,
well, another Aesir. No, not the Catholic
saint... someone else. Very.... uh, thematic!

Whom do I chose... Decisions, decisions :-)

PvK · #5 June 2nd, 2004, 02:41 AM

I think Asynya is plenty good. She looks like a slightly better fighter than the Allfather, and the usual retarded logic is that everyone needs an SC pretender or they are doomed (not that I buy that, but oh well). If you want a pretender with Air and maybe another path who also fights well, she looks good, and saves points compared to Allfather. Allfather has some other abilities and can have more paths for less, though. Apples and oranges, allfathers and asynyas...

They might be more popular since so many people have a secret inner desire to be Odin...

PvK

Norfleet · #6 June 2nd, 2004, 04:14 AM

Well, I don't think I've ever seen anyone pick one. To be honest, it doesn't seem to fill any new niche: It's an air-2 semi-SC, with relatively poor path flexibility when compared to Odin. If you're trying to build an SC, Odin can actually be built more cheaply due to his less expensive paths, despite his base cost. Odin's host of innate abilities also tilts the scale in his favor. If she shared the Allfather's Glamour ability, she'd be a contender for the same role, only on foot instead of mounted, and thus retaining a feet slot, but she doesn't have this - even then, without flying, the feet slot would wind up being used for that, and she isn't as immune to armor encumberance as the Allfather, due to not being mounted.

Obviously, therefore, Odin outclasses the Asynja in the SC department.

As a blessing or high-air chassis, on the other hand, we compare the Asynja to the Titan, which is also available, for 125 points. A quick review of the numbers, however, reveals that the Titan can actually provide the Air-9 blessing at LOWER cost than the Asynja. Both are capable of combat, although in this configuration, neither is really a tweaked super-SC. The Titan also has the benefit of being lightning-immune, which is a fairly nice bonus for an SC, as lightning is really quite painful, and the Titan can indiscriminately fling shockwaves and commit acts of Wrathing without worrying about electrocuting himself.

So, given that the Asynja appears to be caught between the Allfather and the Titan, and is outclassed at both roles, with the Titan being roughly equal in combat, what's the selling point? She doesn't seem to fill any real niche.