Some questions from a newbie

[Willburn]

Hey I was wondering where in the manual (ive skimmed it sometimes) they describe exactly what the area of effect for a spell is. For example False fetters has AoE of 2+ in the manual (p.227) but what does that mean. Will it effect units on 2 squares chosen by the precicion roll or will it affect 2 squares in every direction from where the spell "lands". If you understand the difference?

The second question is a bit more simple - what are good uses for range 1 combat spells? Im trying hard to figure out when it would be possible to guess with a mage how many attacks i need to do to get into melee and then script a combat spell. Any ideas / tips on this ?

Oh and finaly will you be able to both strike in combat and before it use magic? I assume yes because i got a feel that you can do anythign ant it will just deduct the ap for a full attack at the end of the turn when you do the attack, making you have less action points for the next turn. That would make combat mages a bit more viable, only problem I guess is they would be easy to hit due to casting a lot in armor (most likly)

[Willburn]

Oh and by reading the boards I have figured out the + and - deducts or adds depending on your skill in that magic. But this as far as I know isnt mentioned in the manual. For example a theoretical spell with fatigue 5- how much will the fatigue be reduce by casting it with a mage with 3 skill. ( i know of the reduction metioned on page 86-87 but is the - part something else? I mean since some spells have it while others dont.)

And damage spells with + do they add 1 damage per 1 skill point above the spell required ?

[lch]

Willburn said:
Hey I was wondering where in the manual (ive skimmed it sometimes) they describe exactly what the area of effect for a spell is. For example False fetters has AoE of 2+ in the manual (p.227) but what does that mean. Will it effect units on 2 squares chosen by the precicion roll or will it affect 2 squares in every direction from where the spell "lands". If you understand the difference?

An AoE spell targets a square (turn on the grid via "g" to see them) and the AoE effect hits every square that lies in the area of effect: AoE 1 is the whole square, AoE 2 adds all adjacent squares, AoE 3 is a 3x3 square and so on.

Willburn said:
The second question is a bit more simple - what are good uses for range 1 combat spells? Im trying hard to figure out when it would be possible to guess with a mage how many attacks i need to do to get into melee and then script a combat spell. Any ideas / tips on this ?

You don't script those. The mage will use these in melee combat if he isn't scripted to do otherwise. Like during assassination attempts. The only range 1 spells you are taking care of during scripting are buffs for your units.

Willburn said:
Oh and finaly will you be able to both strike in combat and before it use magic? I assume yes because i got a feel that you can do anythign ant it will just deduct the ap for a full attack at the end of the turn when you do the attack, making you have less action points for the next turn. That would make combat mages a bit more viable, only problem I guess is they would be easy to hit due to casting a lot in armor (most likly)

Read up on action points, attacking or casting can only be done once, as last action for a unit. Quickness increases the number of attacks, but you can still only cast one spell per combat turn.

Willburn said:
Oh and by reading the boards I have figured out the + and - deducts or adds depending on your skill in that magic. But this as far as I know isnt mentioned in the manual. For example a theoretical spell with fatigue 5- how much will the fatigue be reduce by casting it with a mage with 3 skill. ( i know of the reduction metioned on page 86-87 but is the - part something else? I mean since some spells have it while others dont.)

The - on fatigue tells that a mage will gain half that fatigue per level that he is higher than the requirement.

Willburn said:
And damage spells with + do they add 1 damage per 1 skill point above the spell required ?

Depends on the spell how much additional stuff you gain.

[Willburn]

Ok thanks Yes I was reading on p.74 where it stands "engaging in melee combat costs all of a units action points." then the example shows that moving will still allow you to attack that turn. So I was wondering if magic would be as moving. I assumed incorrectly Thanks for the answers!

[MaxWilson]

About the 2+ notation, etc:

For fatigue, the spell costs half as much fatigue if the mage has one level higher in the primary path (the first path listed, if there are two, as e.g. FFFDD is primarily Fire) than the spell requires, one third if he has two levels, etc. If the mage has too few levels to cast the spell but does it anyway (e.g. if he's a communion slave casting a spell that only the communion master technically has the paths for) he takes much more fatigue. Using a gem can boost your effective level by one.

For AoE 2+, damage 9+, etc., it depends on the individual spell. Check out DrPraetorious' spreadsheet for specifics. Here's an attempt at a link. If that doesn't work search for "Spell Modding Guide" in the forum search.

-Max

[Willburn]

Yes I know about the half reduction and 1/3, as I said this is on page 86-87. But the manual makes no explenation if this is for every spell or only for spells with the - at the end of the fatigue cost. So thats my question. If its for every spell then why the - mark? There must be somethign special with those spells since they have it.

And im still puzzled by how to know what each + adds. This isnt mention in the manual and the spells2 spreadsheat didnt make that clear either. (the modding link)

And regarding scripting mages: So if i set it to attack closest it will fire off range 1 spells when it gets into melee? Or will it just use its melee attacks?

[llamabeast]

I don't know what you mean about spells with a "-" after the fatigue, I haven't seen that. In any case, fatigue works the same for all spells it costs the amount listed if you're the level required to cast it, half for 1 level above, etc as Max described.

There's no easy way of finding out what the + adds, short of looking it up in a modding spreadsheet or something (I haven't looked at the spreadsheet Max linked to). I just generally think of it as "ooh, and this spell would be even better if it was a higher level caster". Sometimes you can guess what it'd be. For example Falling Fires has AOE 3+. I'm pretty sure the + will be 1 per level.

Touch spells are very hard to use, and in fact people have generally concluded there's no use trying to use them offensively. They're a useful backup for your mages to protect themselves from assassins and no more. They're not much use because (a) they're hard to get them to cast (once in melee mages only have a certain probability of casting anything, because of the distracting environment), and (b) it's just not safe, and your mage would almost always be better off standing back a bit and using ranged spells.

The exceptions are the large AOE ones like Flame Eruption (if I've remembered the name right). There was a thread recently on how to get some use out of them. You'll probably find it in the first few pages of the forum.

[mivayan]

Willburn said:
And regarding scripting mages: So if i set it to attack closest it will fire off range 1 spells when it gets into melee? Or will it just use its melee attacks?

Just melee attacks. Which is a great thing when you have a supercombatant whom(spelling?) you dont want to get tired.

MaxWilson said:
I don't think you can both strike and use magic, but I *think* (never checked the debug log for this) touch spells still require a successful attack roll (and presumably the defender gets a defense roll to oppose this).

I think there's no such roll.

More importantly, there's only a 50% chance of a mage being able to cast a spell when an enemy is in hand-to-hand range, otherwise he will attack hand-to-hand.

-Max

Yup, important to know.

[MaxWilson]

Willburn said:
Oh and finaly will you be able to both strike in combat and before it use magic? I assume yes because i got a feel that you can do anythign ant it will just deduct the ap for a full attack at the end of the turn when you do the attack, making you have less action points for the next turn. That would make combat mages a bit more viable, only problem I guess is they would be easy to hit due to casting a lot in armor (most likly)

Sorry, just noticed this question. I don't think you can both strike and use magic, but I *think* (never checked the debug log for this) touch spells still require a successful attack roll (and presumably the defender gets a defense roll to oppose this). More importantly, there's only a 50% chance of a mage being able to cast a spell when an enemy is in hand-to-hand range, otherwise he will attack hand-to-hand.

-Max