Fleeting w/Bases - causing one problem while fixing another

[jim]

OK -

The game had an exploit that became well known, even notorious. Namely, all bases had an implicit Quantum Reactor such that joining them to a fleet replaced all Supply. It made Resupply Facilities less valuable and even reduced Supply effects.

However, I used Bases in Planetary Defense Fleets for another reason, and that appears to have been defeated by the fix.

The problem was that defending ships would sortie kamikaze-fashion beyond the support range of ground and orbiting defenses. I "fixed" this problem by making Planetary Defense Fleets have a Base as the flagship under a firing scheme that did NOT have the ships break formation.

Result: The ships stayed within the Base firing support, and that of Sats and WPs. It was an elegant solution that greatly enhanced planet defense.

Now, that is no more.

Q-

Is there any other way to fix the Base QR exploit w/o ending this little tactic? Now, with Bases unable to join fleets, I can not do as I have done.

(Whine, whine, whiiiiiiiiiiiiiiine)

[Phoenix-D]

To get around it in the current situation: make a cheap speed 0 something. Ship maybe, or anything that can't move and CAN be fleeted.

Phoenix-D

[geoschmo]

from settings.txt in new patch:
Bases Can Join Fleets := False

But if you want to fleet with the bases and have them not have a built in QR, then SJ has in his mod base size ships that aren't allowed to have engines I believe.

But Phoenix's idea is a good one for stock games though. Very good actually. Simply make a ship with no engines and make that your fleet leader.

Geoschmo

[ August 14, 2002, 02:15: Message edited by: geoschmo ]

[Baron Munchausen]

Why is being able to resupply by fleeting with a base an 'exploit'? Isn't that what a BASE is for? If you accidently have a map where there are several empty systems in sequence there may be no other way to cross the 'void' in the early or mid game and find other useful systems than to build bases and use them as stepping stones.

But I agree that ships are really stupid about planetary defense. Even unarmed ships. What transport captain in his right mind would run AWAY from a heavily armed planet with an enemy fleet approaching? Yet that's what unarmed ships will do right now. It's easy to pick off all the unarmed ships present at a major military base by just sending some ships 'around' the planet to the far corners of the combat grid to wipe them out. Your ships ought to be intelligent enough to stay within range of a planet's armament without resorting to special tricks. And attacking ships ought to be smart enough to stay OUT of range of the planet's armament if other ships in the fleet have greater range weapons (missiles) and can use them.

[ August 14, 2002, 02:40: Message edited by: Baron Munchausen ]

[PvK]

It sounds like a better fix would have been to simply make bases (optionally) not share supplies with others in their fleet. And/or, to make the base resupply ability a low-tech component, and then make such bases automatically resupply ships WITHOUT fleeting, the way a resupply depot does.

PvK

[Cylapse]

I totally agree -- its not an exploit at all. Case in point, DS9...
"Sorry, Captain... We only have enough to maintain our own station, you must go to Bajor for fuel. Or -- try Cardassia. I hear they're nice."

Bases are nearly useless without some kind of refueling potential. Its the point of them not having engines, they sit and dont waste away as much fuel (in our case any) so that they have room for for support facilities and such... But I do think a component would be nicer, that way a measure of control was allowed.

[ August 15, 2002, 15:39: Message edited by: Cylapse ]